Monday, April 23, 2018  |

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Eddie Hearn offers Deontay Wilder $12.5M to fight Anthony Joshua, take it or leave it





10
Apr

The first punch in the proposed heavyweight unification bout between Deontay Wilder and Anthony Joshua was thrown, predictably enough, by one of the promoters.

And no one is quite sure when the next one will be thrown, or even if it will be delivered by one of the fighters.

On Monday night, Eddie Hearn, Joshua’s promoter, made an offer to Al Haymon, adviser to Wilder, for a fight at an unspecified site at a date yet to be determined. The only definitive piece of information in Hearn’s offer was the amount of money he is willing to offer Wilder: $12.5 million.

And with the offer comes a caveat: Take it or leave it.

“If they don’t want it, we’ll fight our mandatory,’’ Hearn told THE RING by telephone on Tuesday morning.

But he added this somewhat encouraging caveat: “If they don’t accept it, the fight’s not dead. It just means we’re going to fight Alexander Povetkin next, and we’ll talk again in December, or February or March of next year.’’

Considering the colorful history of boxing negotiations, Hearn’s offer is probably the first shot in what is likely to be an entertaining period of posturing, saber-rattling, threats and counter-threats that in all likelihood will culminate in the two undefeated heavyweights, one with a huge fan base in his native England and the other with huge power in his right hand, eventually sharing a ring together in what will easily be the biggest heavyweight title fight since Mike Tyson challenged Lennox Lewis in Memphis in 2002.

But the question is, is it still possible for the fight to take place in 2018, or are fight fans in for another year, or more, of waiting?

On Monday, THE RING spoke with Shelly Finkel, a co-manager of Wilder who is the front man for Haymon in the negotiation. Finkel and Hearn had been exchanging emails since last week, and Finkel had been told to expect an offer sometime this week.

“If it’s anything within reason, we’ll do it,’’ said Finkel, who added Wilder had expressed a willingness to fight Joshua before a hostile crowd in the United Kingdom, where Joshua routinely fills stadiums with up to 90,000 highly partisan fans. Finkel also said Wilder and his team would be agreeable to accepting the shorter half of a 60-40 split of all revenue, which is expected to top $50 million.

A day later, however, having been apprised of Hearn’s offer, Finkel seemed a lot less agreeable.

“No comment at all,’’ he said. “We’re preparing a response.’’

Translation: $12.5 million does not fit the definition of “within reason.’’

Lou DiBella, Haymon’s promoter of record for Wilder’s fights, was more blunt: “If you’re going to make an offer that insults Deontay Wilder, it’s obvious Eddie doesn’t want the fight right now.’’

Both fighters defended their titles in March. Wilder survived a near KO loss to Luis Ortiz at the Barclays Center before rallying for probably his most impressive victory yet. Three weeks later, Joshua labored to a disappointing decision win over Joseph Parker, the first time in his career he had been forced to go the distance, to add Parker’s WBO title to his belt collection.

The close call in the Wilder fight conceivably prodded both sides to move on a unification bout before one of the two gets knocked off.

“It’s heavyweight boxing, anything can happen,’’ Hearn said. “There is always the danger someone could get beat and cost everybody a huge payday.’’

The Wilder side concedes that Joshua, who is unbeaten in 21 fights with 20 knockouts, is the bigger draw right now, having packed Wembley Stadium with 90,000 fans for his title-winning effort against Wladmir Klitschko last April, and defended it against Carlos Takam and Parker before crowds of 80,000 in Cardiff’s Principality Stadium. Joshua’s fights also routinely sell upward of 1 million pay-per-view subscriptions in the UK, a number no heavyweight fight has approached in the U.S. since Tyson-Lewis. Joshua also has three of the four heavyweight title belts, the WBA, IBF and WBO. Wilder (41-0, 40 KOS) is the WBC champion.

“We’re the A-side of this matchup,’’ Hearn said. “A 60-40 split is so disproportionate in terms of the relative values of both fighters. Our offer is five times what Deontay Wilder has made for any fight. Everything he gets in this fight is because of Anthony.’’

The Wilder side counters that neither fighter is a proven pay-per-view commodity in the U.S., since neither has appeared in an American pay-per-view events, and in fact, Joshua has never fought on this side of the Atlantic.

“In the UK. Joshua is a rock star of the highest level,’’ DiBella said. “But he could walk down Fifth Avenue and no one would know who he is. He needs Deontay Wilder as much as Deontay needs him.’’

If the Wilder side rejects his offer, Hearn is threatening to fight Povetkin next, and maybe even Jarrell Miller, before coming back to the table in perhaps as long as 18 months down the road. The Wilder side has floated the possibility of a doubleheader featuring he and the comebacking Tyson Fury, in separate bouts, and maybe even in the UK.

“We could call it Power and Fury,’’ DiBella said. “Just to make it clear to Eddie and Joshua that they are not the center of the universe and we do have options.’’

And so it is likely to go between now and whenever the two sides can finally, inevitably, come to a deal.

Asked which of the many fight negotiations he has been involved in was the most difficult, Finkel – who helped broker the Tyson-Michael Spinks fight, an incredibly difficult negotiation in 1988 – said: “This could be it.’’

Asked if he was confident that the fight would get made this year, Finkel said, “If it’s up to us, yes. We want the fight to get done. It’s the right fight at the right time for both fighters. I believe it will happen. But it’s just not happening yet.’’

 





  • learnmore

    First official shot fired, Wilder kept on saying he dont care about the money, he has money. Lets see if thats true. His team can send a counter offer to do it in USA, if they think it makes more there, he can take the offer or try to negotiate a better deal.

    I’m going to look at the positive, an offer has been confirmed by the Wilder side that it was made. I have seen some ludicrous numbers out here, some people are claiming that this fight has a potential revenue of $80-$100m . F**king ludicrous there is only one fight out there which has the potential to do $100m thats GGG v Canelo 2. The reality is Joshua v Wilder is a $30-$50m revenue fight.

    • Fist_ti_cuffs

      You really overestimate ginger and lil g. They will not do 100 million. Joshua vs Wilder is easily the biggest fight in boxing, but maybe they do actually need to wait for a while to make this fight. Those Brits will eventually figure out that they are not getting what they pay for in coming watch Joshua fight overmatched guys. Hopefully they’ll demand more from their Champ.

      • learnmore

        I think you’re overestimating Joshua v Wilder,I’m dealing with facts,GGG v Canelo1, gate receipt was $27m the 3rd highest in US boxing history behind MayPac & MayMac. There did 1.5m PPV buy at $79.99 a pop.

        $27m gate receipts + $120m PPV revenue = $147m revenue for GGG v Canelo 1. Anyway near 1m PPV buys for GGG v Canelo 2 gets $100m because I expect the 2nd fight will do less PPV numbers.

        The reality of Joshua v Wilder in the UK, 90k at Wembley vs Klitschko done £12m gate receipt, the box office rumours were that it done around 1.5m dont know if thats true, but anywhere that was £19.95 a pop. £12m gate receipt + £30m Sky Box Office revenue= £42m, conversion would be less then but using the rates now its a revenue of $60m. If you want to get closer to $100m they would have to do a US PPV in the afternoon. Lets give it 200k PPV at $50 a pop = $10m. UK revenue $60m + US revenue if they did a US PPV in the afternoon $10m=$70m

        • Al mac

          You have not thrown in advertising revenue and also broadcast rights in foreign markets. Whatever the total pot is Wilder needs to get his fair share. Parker is less marketable and comes from a much smaller country and he got 33% so Wilder needs to get paid more. Eddie Hearn does not want the fight as he wants to continue to milk his cash cow that’s why he sent a joke offer. If the offer was serious it would start at a realistic split and at least have a date and venue named.

          • learnmore

            $12.5m is a reasonable offer, Wilder is getting the 2nd most purse of any of Joshua’s opponents. Only Klitschko got a higher purse. If he aint happy Wilder team put in a better offer, they cant even pay Wilder $12.5m, Wilder has no argument, they could of given him a less offer.

      • learnmore

        Finally if they had Joshua v Wilder in the US, this has more possibility to get nearer to $100m down to the X Factor. The problem here is that neither have done PPV in the USA & it will be a guess what the gate receipts will be & how much PPV it will do.

        If I had a guess $15m-$20m gate receipts with the right price point & I reckon Joshua v Wilder only do around 500k PPV and the revenue there will depend on the price point. I will guess 1st PPV for both, low price point of $50 a pop = $35m. My estimate in USA will be $55m-$70m revenue

        For Joshua v Wilder to get anywhere near $100m revenue it will need to do a higher US PPV numbers than I think it will do.

        • Fist_ti_cuffs

          You’re absolutely correct. This is Hearns chance to be the man almost as much as Joshua and he’s relishing the opportunity. I really like Joshua and he just might beat Deontay, but Hearn has him looking horrible to us hardcore boxing fans stateside. I guess we’ll just have to wait a while longer for this matchup.

        • Michael Montero

          No one in the U.S will pay for Wilder v Joshua.

          • Jeremy, UK

            This is why I think Hearn prefers to make Joshua v Miller in NY (although that doesn’t seem possible due to the WBA now calling the mandatory vs Povetkin). Yes AJ would be a strong favourite to beet BBM, but the characters of the two would create a lot of interest in the Big Apple. This would raise the profile of the whole heavyweight division in the US and ultimately benefit all the champs/contenders.

      • Michael Montero

        Okay Farrakhan

  • WR

    I’m Confused Didn’t Wilder say money is not important
    That he would take a low figure of 5% as long as AJ did the same in a rematch?
    But now 12 millions is too little?
    Btw someone should let Lou Dibella in on a little secret not many ppl walking down the street know who Deontay Wilder is either

    • learnmore

      Tell Dibella there is a lot of tourists probably walking down Fifth Avenue, so I would guess they would be people who knows Joshua.

      WR its funny, Wilder running around for weeks, I just want the fight . I dont care about money blah blah blah, yap yap. To be fair to Wilder they’re no quotes from him. His team is finally speaking for him.

      • EternallyILL

        None of those tourists would be American. That was his point.

    • Chris J Bonds

      You can’t be serious. Who in their right mind would take a flat offer in one of the most anticipated matches in boxing? Let’s be realistic people!

      • Michael Montero

        That’s a great offer, Wilder doesn’t deserve more than 30%.

        • Matt M

          Joshua has 3 of the main belts. Wilder has 1.
          Therefore I say Joshua deserves 75/25.
          That equates to $12.5M of $50M.
          Take the offer Deontay and back up your words, or maybe
          call Hearns bluff (if that’s what this is).
          Aside from my tongue in cheek 3 belts to 1 point,
          AJ really is the much bigger draw and I agree Wilder
          should get an absolute maximum of 30%.

    • left hook

      Hate it when fighters say money is not a issue. Wilder was just talking rubbish at the time. Provodinikov said the same rubbish too. Truth is money is everything. And to be honest..”take it or leave it” is an insult to Wilder and his team. Both parties should get in a room and negotiate.

      • Julio

        I don’t see why it is an insult. An offer was made, its up to the other party to either agree with it or not. Simple.

        • left hook

          To u is not to other it might be. Wilder is also a champion.

          • Julio

            A champion he is, but how can you say that the money offered is an insult when he would be making several times more than what he has ever made or will make?

          • left hook

            To u it’s not an insult to him it’s an insult. 60 40 is fair or even wilder getting 35% is also fair. If your son was in Wilders shoes u will be singing a different tune.

          • Julio

            Under what consideration is fair your proposition? What does Wilder really brings up to the table under the current boxing climate? And let me flip the script on you, could you realistically envision Wilder offering Joshua a 60/40 split if he was in Joshua’s shoes? Come on man.

          • left hook

            Wilder brings his undefeated record, his punch power, US fans, his belt, ring championship and undisputed championship. If Wilder was in joshua’s shoes…nobody knows for a fact what would have happened but I know I will be saying 60/40 too.

          • Julio

            Seriously? Can you be that naive to believe that Wilder would offer Joshua 60/40 if he was the main draw? SMH.

          • left hook

            U asked me what he brings to table…I listed it. Am happy u didn’t dispute them.
            Can u tell me how u know for sure Wilder would not offer Joshua 60/40 and I just dont want some emotionally hate reply about Wilder…pls states facts.

          • Julio

            I speak in terms of what the boxing climate is nowadays. Your points are fine, but they are more wishful thinking to a large degree. That’s the difference. I have no reason to dispute your perspective because it doesn’t quite align with what boxing is about now. Hopefully, they will be able to work it out.

          • left hook

            U twisting the what u said. I said what Wilder brings to the table…Now u saying “nowadays”. Have u participated in a boxing negotiation before? Have u even boxed before? So how do u know how boxing is now. U want wilder to take less simply because u don’t like the guy.

          • Julio

            Dude, don’t get so worked up about something so inane like this. Secondly, for a guy like you that seems to know about the sport, you should also know that boxing is a business first, and then a sport. From the business standpoint, Wilder brings very little to the table. That is all I am saying. Now go outside and catch some fresh air.

          • left hook

            Not worked up at all…in fact am outside as I reply to u..lol.
            I listed what Wilder brings to table and u agree I was right..now u saying he brings little…I think u need the fresh air and stop the hate. If business comes 1st then let’s leave them to do the business and wait for the actual fight.

    • calvin

      you think AJ will accept $12.5 million flat fee in a rematch? no way in hell. in a fight this lucrative a flat fee is an insult.

    • EternallyILL

      If you were a fight promoter who got paid based on what your fighter makes. Would you stand back and let your fighter take 5% for a fight of this magnitude?

      • Wayne

        If I was said Promoter I would advise my fighter to stop suggesting and or making crazy ℅ deals about the same said fight in every interview

  • Left Hook2

    OMG…now Wilder is worth something? Take the $12M. Life’s not fair–look at GGG-Canelo–but good short money is better than lower ‘A’ side money.

    • John Newman

      Golovkin is the gold standard for taking the best and most reasonable deals he can get and quite literally fighting his way to the top.

  • Jayo2.0

    I think Wilder should take the money, win, then flip the script for the rematch.

    • learnmore

      I dont think he will take it, they’re going to play the social media game to get support to put pressure on Joshua to give a better offer. I think they will be happy at the moment a higher percentage thinks its a bad offer.

      One early poll what I seen so far only around 20% say he should take it, more than 40% say it should be 60/40 & 35% say it should be 65/35 & 5% say 50/50, It could change.

      So they have support out there, not to take it

    • Julio

      I agree. Wilder is in no position to make any reasonable demands. Prove your case first, and then windfall of cash will come.

      • John Grady

        Excellent points. In fact, I do not think DW has much of a choice, as AW has almost all the leverage in terms of negotiations.

  • learnmore

    RING you’ve $50m revenue in the article, why’re their people saying that it would do $80-$100m. And running with that figure?

    • Chris

      Wilder fans want to get to a percentage and make it low.

      The truth is nobody knows the value the problem is they are trying to factor in US ppv when neither has a record remember Kov Ward dramatically under earned and Ward was over paid.

      If Wilder wanted the same deal as Parker he could get it in a heartbeat.

      The problem is Finkel and Di Bella want to shout in the media for months and they have 30 days.

      Hearn said it himself once Higgins was in a room the impossible deal got done.

      • learnmore

        Hearn was just on twitter a few hours ago replying to someone who put a list of Joshua’s oppnents estimate purse. The person had Klitschko £15m Parker £13m Wilder £8.8m Martin £6m Takam £750k, Hearn implied that Parker & Martin info was incorrect & he tweeted regarded tha Parker £13m that “cut in half & its still too much”

        And he also responded to the $100m figure by someone, he said it is madness, $40m is an conservative budget. That number looks more right for a UK revenue, so I agree with you its Wilder fans pushing it to use has a narrative

    • Al mac

      No one knows the true figures because the event has not happened yet. Parker got 33% of all the revenues so why can’t Wilder get that plus a small premium and make the fight rather than this joke offer of a flat fee. Joshua said it was a great offer that he would jump at well then Finkel should reverse the names on the contract and send it back to them. Aj can have his great flat fee and Wilder takes the percentage.

      • learnmore

        You’re making no sense, thats their problem they cant make an offer. Wilder is an American Heavyweight, fighting in the biggest market, managed by Haymon & Finkel who has been involved in some of the biggest fights and they cant put an offer together to send to Joshua for him to travel to America. If they think you can get $100m revenue in USA, send Joshua an offer.

        The reality is this fight is a $40m+ fight in the UK & thats if they hit enough UK PPV numbers, unlike the US charging $50, $60, $70, $80+, the UK PPV cost is £20, so $12.5m is between 30% to 35%, you can do the maths

  • Drebin_Frank

    Sounds like Hearn’s pricing AJ out of this one… As if Wilder camp’s gonna be happy with a flat fee. I’m an AJ fan but seriously wish his team would stop taking the p!ss with this.

    Just go with 60/40 or 65/35 and flip it for the re-match to the winner in USA. Negotiation over (in under 20 words).

    • Julio

      The problem is, what financial muscle does Wilder brings to the table? Virtually zero. Wilder averages about 2M per fight, whereas Joshua makes 20M fighting his own shadow. Wilder has no fan base at all in his own backyard. When Floyd tried to do the same with Pacquiao with the flat fee proposition it was really an insult. Wilder’s clout is extremely thin to make any real demands.

      • TMT NYC-DA REAL GHOSTBUSTERS

        Haha! I see what you did there, using words like “muscle” and “thin” to talk about Wilder.

      • Drebin_Frank

        I don’t think seeking a % split rather than a flat fee is an other-worldly demand. If they gave Parker @ 33% then Wilder deserves the same, if not a little more. He’s got one of the reputable titles. He’s got the fear factor – the ‘baddest man’ persona etc. He’s even got the ‘windmill’. It’s the final unification bout. The fight sells itself in UK, & I think it’d be a pretty easy sell in the USA for the follow-up bout (unless AJ absolutely smoked him in an apparent mismatch; any other outcome would still be $$$).

        Hopefully it’s all just part of the ‘negotiations’ rather than an attempt to blow-off the fight.

        • Julio

          Sounds all well and good what you say, but let me ask you, do you know how much exactly Parker earned with his 33%? I seriously doubt it was anywhere near 12.5M. That being said, Wilder’s “baddest man” persona works only in his mind. He has’t earned that reputation like a Tyson, Foreman, or Liston did for instance.

          • Turner Wednesday

            To be fair, prior to his first loss, who did Tyson actually beat? His record is somewhat similar to Wilders.

          • Jeremy, UK

            In a 19 month period he beat Berbick, Smith, Thomas, Tucker, Biggs, Holmes, Tubbs and Spinks. 7 World champs and 2 Olympic champs. Not too shabby!

          • Julio

            My friend, Tyson was a real draw and a household name. Tyson had a pretty decent run while unifying the division and becoming the undisputed HW champ in less than two years. Apples to oranges.

        • Jeremy, UK

          But it’s only the final unification because Joshua has done all the hard work and cleaned up the other titles (overpaying people like Parker to get in this position). Wilder has just sat on his WBC title for 3 years!

    • left hook

      Very simple. A flat fee is taking the piss.

    • Jeremy, UK

      Why should they? Why would Wilder deserve 40%?

      • wrecksracer

        Does Joshua want to be the undisputed champ? How badly does he want the legacy defining fight? He is literally buying an opportunity to make history. If it’s not worth the price, then he can continue with the flat fee BS.

        • Jeremy, UK

          But Joshua (and his team) did that with Martin and Parker especially. Why are you saying Joshua should buy the opportunity to win one more title, but not suggesting Wilder should buy the opportunity to capture the three titles that AJ has? Surely it’s his turn as he has done nothing thus far to unify the title!

          • wrecksracer

            Joshua is the clear a-side. He’s the one setting the terms, not Wilder. If the shoe were on the other foot, I would say the same about Wilder. He would have to be the one “buying” the opportunity for the last title.

            This fight is bigger than Martin or Parker anyway. I’m not sure a flat rate is going to cut it. Well, we’re talking about negotiations between millionaires. Neither are hurting for money. My guess…the flat rate ends up stalling the negotiations. Wilder can play “keep away” with his title until Joshua comes up with a percentage deal.

          • Jeremy, UK

            I think that’s true… I won’t lose any sleep for either of them if they end up getting $1m less than they want! I believe a percentage agreement (at least partially) must be agreed. This is surely Hearn’s way of putting Wilder in an awkward position of putting up or shutting up as his narrative of AJ and his team running from him was starting to get momentum- although logic should convince people otherwise.

  • Andy Kayne

    The way I see it is that AJ does not need Wilder but Wilder needs AJ. Even if AJ never fights Deontay Wilder, he’ll always have the prospect of fighting interim and top 5 fighters around the world and still pack out arenas in the UK, the same way the Klitschko brothers cornered heavyweight boxing in Germany for a decade.
    Five to ten more fights undefeated will be a big money spinner for AJ, big endorsement deals and make him one of the most revered men in sport and also incredibly rich.
    Deontay Wilder could only hope his profile gets a boost to attract more fans of boxing to his fights otherwise he will be the other champion that nobody wants to talk about and probably end up making the WBC belt seem inconsequential.
    It used to be Mayweather but now AJ is the lottery ticket in boxing.
    All AJ needs to do is keep bringing exciting fights and stadiums will keep getting full.
    There are other big names apart from Deontay Wilder. The same way there were other big names for Mayweather to fight than Manny Pacquiao. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/925c028e47e2d3234550c99d061e4ee6bb160028e0c34f6d79344a42110986c2.jpg

  • Joey Junger

    I think Hearn was watching Povetkin-Price and thinking, if Povetkin looks great tonight, we’ll give Wilder a reasonable sixty-forty split and get the deal inked. Then David Price puts Povetkin down (but not out) and Hearn smiles, thinks, “Maybe Povetkin is ripe to be rolled by peak Joshua.” This way Hearn gives his boy an out against the man he knows could rip his primary meal ticket to shreds. The Joshua-Parker fight was brokered in pounds, not dollars, so they’re definitely insulting Deontay with this low-ball. And yes, Hearn is pretty much saying he’s offering this deal in bad faith because he’s not sure AJ won’t get KO’d. I still think Wilder should call the bluff and take the first deal offered. It would throw Joshua’s camp for a loop. It ain’t happening though.

  • PrinceGian

    This reminds me of bartering for items in Bali, one person starts at the lowest end and the other at the highest end and you go backwards and forwards until you get to a price you both agree to. My guess is this will go the same way until a percentage split is agreed to. The only problem is how long will the bartering go for? If they both take other opponents in the interim, both take the risk of losing thus stuffing everything up.

  • Michel Desgrottes

    Why they not offering him what they offered Parker?

    • learnmore

      Could it be that they’re offering Wilder more than Parker actually got paid on a split agreement. UK newspaper reported in December 2017 that Parker should get £7m ($9m+), if that was true Wilder been offered $12.5m is more.

    • WR

      The fight is much bigger than the Parker event..Parker made less than $12m. Remember 12m is Not 12% of the fight like some boxing fans think

      • Michel Desgrottes

        Wilder is already doing promo for the fight in the states, and if they capitalize off of USA PPV, wilder will be helping with that in the states, that has to account for something

        • WR

          What Ppv sales?
          There’s no sales track record of Wilder to base it off of
          Only Canelo/Floyd do Big Ppv numbers

          • philoe bedoe

            Exactly………..

          • Michel Desgrottes

            Yea I never said wilder has done ppv before

  • Jason

    Wilder camp should take the fight and respond with:

    – $15M Flat Fee
    – David Fields is the Referee
    – August 2018
    – Wembley Stadium
    – One USA Judge, One UK Judge, One South Africa
    – No rematch Clause regardless of result

    It’s a no brainer to take the fight. it’s the ref that matters most. Someone that will just let them fight. An EU/UK ref cannot be trusted here. As snaky as the Joshua camp appears here, they have a point. The whole production is Joshua – just take $15m and beat him. Figure out a follow-up after that. Don’t let them have an automatic rematch clause or you have to beat him twice.

    • John Newman

      I think that’s a completely reasonable offer. I think that Wilder will want a percentage instead of a flat fee, because the potential reward is greater (even if it drags out negotiations).

      • Julio

        How many boxing fans are willing to pay to watch Wilder? That is the first question one needs to ask about Wilder wishing a percentage of the PPV revenue.

        • John Newman

          That’s the first question of many.

        • BobbyPFalcon

          Wilder is just as popular in the US as Joshua – which is not at all. Joshua is not ready to fight Wilder and Hearn’s lowball offer reflects this.

  • Jay

    He’s offering Wilder less than 20%. How you gonna offer Parker more money? Seems like ducking tactics to me.

    • AngelMorningstar

      What Wilder make his last fight? Answer 2.1 million. He’s being offered TWELVE million and that’s piss poor?! You suck at math!

    • Jeremy, UK

      Every fight Joshua has, they have to pay the opponent far more than they have ever earned before… why? That tells you who the draw is. Also they paid over the top to get the big fights for AJ to increase his profile and gain titles. Wilder’s team couldn’t be bothered and refused to speculate to accumulate. That’s why Hearn and AJ are standing their ground now. They are in the position to call the shots and they have earned it. Joshua v Povetkin is 5 to 10 times bigger than Wilder v anyone else (except Tyson Fury, but don’t hold you breath on that one!)

    • John Newman

      12.5 is 25% of the expected earnings.

      • Jeremy, UK

        For the 25% of the crown he possesses… seems fair.

  • Jay

    It should be 60-40 since AJ is the A side. Either way, Wilder is gonna knock his ass out.

  • philoe bedoe

    Does Lou Dibella say anything else but “he’s scared of Wilder” lol.
    He’s done a piss poor job of promoting Deontay, a charismatic big punching ko artist in the heavyweight division whose had nearly forty fights.
    He should be a ppv star by now if he was matched and promoted right……………

    • John Newman

      That’s really his best argument. That, and Wilder should get more than 25% because Joshua wants his belt (and our cost for a shot at the belt is more than 25%). He doesn’t have any other leverage. It’s a bit ridiculous.

      • Crowley

        His marketing has been no less than awful. Still, a 40-0 record with 39 KOs? Cant just dismiss that. People whine about the competition he’s faced but get real, this is heavyweight boxing. One punch can change everything.

  • Tony Nightstick

    “Take it or leave it” is not usually the way it’s done in business.

    • WR

      Remember Wilder first said 50/50 or no Deal…..be fair

  • Ryan V Matthews

    If Wilder takes the 12 Million and beats Joshua, then he’s champion and calls all the shots and can charge what he wants to other boxers.

    • ceylon mooney

      right on. that offer is there to delay the fight. i say call his bluff again! they backed themselves into a corner.

  • Andy T

    Wilder earned 2.1 million dollars fighting Ortiz and wants to be the undisputed heavyweight champ so he has been offered this opportunity and a $10 pay rise and it is unacceptable?
    If the offer is so bad what will Wilder’s promoters put in front of AJ?

    • Turner Wednesday

      A $10 pay rise is bad. That’s barely minimum wage.

      • WR

        Lol

      • Andy T

        Edited it now to 10 million dollars

    • WR

      You Mean $10M right?

      • Andy T

        Yeh

  • Michel Desgrottes

    With all the jabbering wilder would do before the fight, that’s awesome promo you can’t put a price on, give him anywhere between 35%-40%

    Otherwise let’s all just move on cause Eddie and AJ lowballing is petty

    • WR

      Wilder does a lot of “jabbering” before all his previous fights & yet can’t sell out his hometown or any other US arena… only makes average $3m a fight with an increase to $12M is $$ he won’t even make in total fighting his next 3 opponents…Facts!

      • Michel Desgrottes

        wilder did boomer and gio first take desus and mero breakfast club sports ilustrated tv, he never did all that in a weeks span to promote a fight, but he has now for AJ fight, no comparison, his comments from the breakfast club alone made waves in media so much so that the wbc had to respond

        • Wayne

          All of that promo…..
          And still no one really knows him
          smh

          • Guy Grundy

            Hit the proverbial nail on the head.

            His self promotion/promotion is abysmal.The ONLY thing he brings to a UK fight is the last belt.NOTHING more.

          • Michel Desgrottes

            Lmao yea ok

      • Michel Desgrottes

        and thats fax no printer

    • Michael Montero

      Why would he give him a percentage that high? Joshua s the money fight just like Floyd was, Wilder is no Pacquiao

      • Michel Desgrottes

        Because becoming undisputed is that valuable, you’re paying for that green belt, and if they wanna be undisputed as they claim, it pays to play, especially with an opponent like wilder who will do his best to promote the fight, as he already has been doing with his media press run

        Why give Parker 33%

        • Jeremy, UK

          To put themselves in the driving seat, which they have!

        • John Newman

          Parker had 33% of the belts on the line for the fight. Wilder has 25% of the belts that would be on the line. Hence, 12.5 million, or 25% of the expected earnings.

        • Wayne

          Parker’s 33% worked out to be around 13/14M
          Do the maths…..

          • Michel Desgrottes

            Exactly u a fool if u think wilder ain’t worth more

          • Wayne

            You a fool to think the Parker’s 33% was more than the $12.5M Wilder was offered lol

          • Michel Desgrottes

            Did I say Parkers dollar amount was greater? I said percentage, every event can have a different value, and this fight means more than the Parker fight

        • Michael Montero

          The same green belt that was won off Stiverne who himself won in a vacant title bout. Nigga please

          • Michel Desgrottes

            Who did AJ first best for the ibf, and how, please remind me, wigger please

          • Michael Montero

            AJ is the draw. End of

          • Michel Desgrottes

            AJ doesn’t have the green belt but claims he wants it, end of

          • Michael Montero

            Retard

          • Michel Desgrottes

            you mad

        • Julio

          Because Parker didn’t earn 12.5 M.

        • Andy T

          Do his best to promote the fight 2.1 million dollars last fight I think he needs to get on the phone to Eddie to promote him.

          • Michel Desgrottes

            How is Eddie doing promoting Danny Jacobs, serious question no troll

          • Left Hook2

            He has him active on the HBO calendar, for whatever that is worth. In fact, he might be the face of HBO non-ppv..So the answer is…I don’t know if it is better or worse. I suppose active is better..

          • Chris

            Depends on your point of view really, he did seem to get the HBO contract at the same time. Probably too early to tell.

          • Andy T

            Ok manoeuvred Danny into a mandatory position I do think he would be better for Wilder as the heavyweight division seems to be on the up in the U.K.

          • Michael Montero

            You think Hearn is milking a ‘brotha’

          • Michel Desgrottes

            How

          • Charlie U.

            Considering Danny’s been facing nobodies and HBO is still broadcasting him, I’d say Hearn’s not doing too bad.

          • Michel Desgrottes

            Has his brand gotten bigger, has he expanded his reach, is he a bigger star, Has he raised his profile, is Eddie making him a household name?

          • Charlie U.

            Yep. Because every time GGG or Canelo is mentioned, Danny Jacobs is mentioned. The boxing media gets his opinion on everything related to two of the top four biggest stars in the sport. Very few boxers are household names in the U.S. I would say Pacquiao, Mayweather (retired) and maybe, MAYBE Canelo. That’s a pretty high bar to set for a promoter in a niche sport in the U.S.

  • Michel Desgrottes

    im surprised not at least $15M-$17M

    • Al mac

      It should be a percentage of all revenues just like Parker got. Parker got 33/34% so Wilder needs to get slightly more not substantially less. If the fight were to generate 100m then Wilder would make 12% which is less than half of what a non belt holder would get. This is not a serious offer.

    • Chris

      It was looks like the the 12.5 million dollars was a Wilder fan boy fail.

      It was 12,5 ukp which is about 1.8M usd which off a 50 million dollar fight minus everyones cut, stadium etc looks about 36 %

      Given the Wilder fans were still claiming it was a 100M USD fight AJ has just offered to take a guaranteed 50M USD flat fee and they’ve shut up .. lol

      Wilder has a better belt but AJ gained another one post Parker and is offering a two fight deal which Parker never got

      This Hearn deal is actually fair.

  • Robert

    This is the best sign so far. We have seen these types of negotiations before. This is just the first offer, which means both sides want to make the fight happen.

    Also, I find it interesting that the same people who thought Mayweather was ducking Pac because of the flat fee and low-ball offers was proof of Mayweather ducking, but now Wilder should be happy with what he gets. Pacquiao also said he would fight Mayweather for free.

    • Andy T

      Disagree until Pac Man declined these were two A side stars granted Mayweather was A+ but this is not the case here.
      Josh clear A side and has worked to get his 4 belts whilst Wilder has plodded on with the one belt and been poorly promoted and managed with no real fan base.
      Wilder 2.1million dollars for his last fight and now offered 12 million dollars and the chance to hold 5 belts I dont think the deal is to shabby.

  • Reggie Woodard

    At least negotiations have begun….

  • John Newman

    12.5 is 25% of the expected earnings. Which is low, but not egregious. I think 30% would have been reasonable enough to expect Wilder to sign on the spot (he wouldn’t have, and neither would DiBella), but Hearn’s position is still not unfair.

    If DiBella’s contention is that Joshua is not a proven PPV star (which is true), then Wilder’s team should happily accept 12.5 million and negotiate for a 50% split of the US PPV revenue. Wilder and his team won’t do that, because they have no intention of spending money on PPV promotion and know that Wilder is no more a PPV star than Joshua.

    25% is no joke offer, especially when you consider that Joshua will likely make around the same amount of money on the Povetkin fight (and will make more if it is held in Russia).

    • Robert Archambault

      What US PPV revenue? Wilder is not a PPV draw in the US and neither is AJ, not to mention that this fight will be on in the late afternoon in the US and that’s not the time for a PPV.

      • John Newman

        That was more or less my point. I think it’s fair to tell DiBella that he can have the lion’s share of PPV revenue when that’s his biggest reason for criticizing the offer from Hearn. There’s no magical, hidden money that takes this from a $50 million fight to a $100 million fight (as Wilder’s team and supporters claim).

        • Robert Archambault

          OK, gotcha! Totally agree. But I still say there should be a split and 65-35 would be fair. Or they can take the idea I have proposed for other fights as a very fair proposal and that is 35-35 with the remaining 30% to the winner. This way each fighter gets a fair payday and the winner actually gets something for winning the damn fight. Brings back the PRIZE to PRIZE fighting.

          • Guy Grundy

            I’d be amazed if there won’t be a rematch clause ( to take place in the US even should Joshua win ) in the final contract.I agree about the 65-35 split as Wilder brings little to the table,save the final belt,so should Wilder win,he can rightly dictate terms for the return fight. If he loses, he’s left with no bargaining position whatsoever…and rightly so.

          • Robert Archambault

            I always feel that rematch clauses should be contingent on how the first fight goes. If it’s a total blowout, there is no point for a rematch. If it’s a late stoppage after a close fight or a close decision, I have no problem with it. Take Lemieux for example… there was nothing in either his TKO loss to GGG or his wide decision loss to BJS that would warrant his getting a rematch with either in my eyes.

          • Guy Grundy

            No,I agree entirely.. but this being an elite heavyweight match up, it differs in so far as no one expects it to go the full distance and you’d get better odds on Bigfoot/ the Loch Ness monster existing than Wilder winning on points.It’s clearly going to be explosive,who lands first and who’s the most resilient ( clearly Joshua is by far the better boxer and has power in both hands but Wilder has that brutal right ) and it could go either way…so I’d think it a given that both teams would insist on a rematch clause.

          • Robert Archambault

            I know that they would most likely want a rematch clause, but that clause should be dependent on the result of the fight. Rematch clause or not, would anyone want to see a rematch of a fight like Canelo-Chavez Jr.? Would anyone pay to see it?

          • Left Hook2

            It’s like Canelo-anybody. B-side gets the scraps, because that is more money than they can make anywhere else. I think Wilder should take it—it is more than fair based on what he brings to the table and what he is capable of making on his own…way more. He’s not a mandatory challenger, so he is not owed anything according to the sanctioning body %. Otherwise he can fight his own mandatory, Dillian Whyte, and make the same $2M-$3M he got versus Ortiz. Then Brazeale. Then rematch Ortiz. I know what I would do. Pride doesn’t pay bills.

          • Robert Archambault

            NO CHAMPION should accept the insult of a flat fee. That’s bullshit. It was bullshit when Oscar offered it to GGG and it’s bullshit now.

          • Jeremy, UK

            It depends on what the flat fee is. If Wilder’s people really believe that the total purse could be $100m and they are prepared for a 40/60 split, they should offer AJ a flat fee of $60m. I’m sure AJ wouldn’t be too insulted!

          • Robert Archambault

            Wilder’s people aren’t in position to make any offers as they are not in charge of the promotion. And the rest of your post is just too stupid to bother with.

          • Jeremy, UK

            Why, because they know $100m is BS? Which part of the post is stupid Robert?

          • Robert Archambault

            The idea that anyone would make an offer of a $60 million flat fee. Not to mention that no one offers a flat fee unless they know they will come out way ahead on the deal.

            We all know why flat fees are offered, it’s to insult an opponent and to drag out negotiations for a few months or years.

            Offer him 25% or even 20% and it will also be rejected but at least it’s more respectful than a flat fee. A flat fee is like you are paying someone to wash your windows or change the oil on your car. You are hiring someone for a job and do not consider it to be anything more.

          • Jeremy, UK

            Ok. Well the suggestion that Wilder’s camp should offer $60m was to highlight that it is them, and only them, that believes the fighters can split a purse of $100m. They are using that figure to imply that DW is being offered the equivalent of 12.5%, which is not accurate. I think you are wrong to say that Wilder’s camp are not in a position to make an offer… of course they are! No one is in control of the promotion yet as there is no fight at this point. It’s unlikely that that Hearn will let Wilder’s team run the promotion as he and Joshua have the leverage, but it will speed up negotiations if they were to put in a counter offer. I expect exactly this to happen within the next few days.

          • Robert Archambault

            OF course there will be a counter offer. Like I said, a flat fee offer is to get negotiations going and should never be accepted. Only a damn fool accepts the first offer on the table. I think this will go on for a while and both will take other fights before it’s all worked out.

          • Jeremy, UK

            But you also said that Wilder’s camp weren’t in a position to make an offer! At least negotiations have begun, because of the “insulting” offer from Hearn.

        • kingpin914

          Eddie Hearn himself was actually the person that introduced the $100M figure. I agree tho, It can’t be a $100M fight in the UK. It would have to be in Vegas to touch those numbers.

    • learnmore

      I reckon they’re using conservative estimates to make the offer, the revenue will always depend on the PPV numbers. The offer is not unfair, they taking the risk putting up the money. If they dont hit the lowest estimates, Wilder still go home with $12.5m.

      They know what the gate receipt will be because of Klitschko fight made £12m ($17m), they probably could change some of the ticket price points now they’ve done 4 stadium events & get it closer to $20m revenue for the gate receipts. The bulk of the remaining revenue depends on PPV numbers to get to the $40m which Hearn is using has the conservative estimate they will need 700k PPV buys at £20 a pop to get to £14m ($20m).

      If they can get to Klitschko 1.5m PPV numbers it will be massive upside to Joshua/Matchroom, but I really dont know if Joshua v Wilder is bigger than Joshua v Klitschko. Taking into account Joshua v Whyte did 400k, I think Hearn is doing the right thing of making an offer using the conservative estimate of $40m revenue, which $12.5m is over 30%.

  • Guy Grundy

    I think we’re witnessing another Hearn masterclass in (promoter) negotiating,best realized by him saying, “everything he gets in this fight is because of Anthony”.DiBella’s retorts are simply feeble.As for Joshua walking down Fifth Avenue? Wilder walking down the same street would have exactly the same outcome… and it’s in his country!

    He’s Mr Invisible.

    Get it signed or you’ll be left at the altar looking a chump,Champ!

    • Crowley

      Your boy won’t ever be undisputed without taking Wilders belt. And this kind of joke offer just makes it clear that Hearn has done his “analysis” and come to the conclusion that the cash cow will get slaughtered. Best walk away, find something to blame.

  • Robert Archambault

    Two champions meeting in a unification fight demands a percentage split, not a flat rate. I’m not a Wilder fan in any possible way but when Oscar offered GGG a flat fee to fight Canelo I said it was bullshit and I apply the same standards for any other fighter. Make it a 65-35 split which I believe is fair. If Wilder wins, he can demand the reverse split in the rematch. What is important is that the fight gets made. I’m sure neither fighter will be hurting for money when all is said and done.

    • Julio

      If neither fighter will be hurting for money, do you believe Wilder would if he takes home five times more than what he has ever made for any fight so far in his career?

      • Robert Archambault

        That’s not the point. The point is being fair and respectful to your opponent. I don’t think any champion should accept a flat fee for any fight and I think making such an offer is disrespectful. What I would prefer would be a 35-35 split with the remaining 30 going to the winner. In my book, the top PRIZE in PRIZE FIGHTING should go to the winner, the best fighter, not the one with the most fans or the better promoter.

        • Julio

          Your concept is very commendable, but not very realistic in the current boxing climate. This fight is big because of Joshua, who has put in the work to be where he is and that is why he commands big purses and crowds. What Wilder has done to elevate his brand? I think he has been poorly managed and promoted. Like I said in a previous post, when Floyd did the exact same thing with Pacquiao, that was indeed unfair and a disrespect to a fighter of Pacquiao’s stature. WIlder seemingly wants to win the lottery without buying the ticket. Take what is on the table, beat the cash cow, and then you call the shots.

  • NP

    Not sure what aside from ego is the problem. Joshua is where the money is, the bigger draw, with a better track-record of bringing in the money and the crowds, and holds 3 belts to one.

    If you’re the B-Side (Wilder), take the low split at around 35% first, yet a career high payday, with a guaranteed rematch clause of something like 60-40 for the winner, in the venue they choose, I.e Vegas if they wish.

    Not sure of the downside! If Joshua wins he takes the lion’s share, all the belts, and is ‘the man’ of the division so it’s earned. If Wilder wins, he earned a career high payday and can then earn even more dictating the terms in a rematch, which would only be right as undisputed champ.

    They could even throw a 50/50 rematch clause for a third fight if they win one apiece!! By then the interest could be immense!

    Either way these guys will need each other over the next year!

    Jesus, I should be a boxing promoter!

    • Guy Grundy

      You nailed It!

    • Al mac

      Did you even read the article they never offered Wilder 35%. They offered him a flat fee and zero cut of TV, gate and advertising. If the fight makes 100m Wilder would have pocked 12.5%. Do you see the problem with the deal? The other problems with the deal is that there is no date for the fight and Wilder even if he wins has to give Joshua a rematch at the exact same terms. This is a joke offer and Eddie Hearn knows it.

      • NP

        Yeah, because we all know this ‘take it or leave it’ comment is the final say! Just like the initial Parker offer came in at about 20% and no deal was possible, and look what happened.

        Wilder said he’d take 40%; Hearn is going to do his job and come in with something lower. I’d imagine the $12.5m is a guaranteed minimum too with a lot of other negotiations to take place, that’s why there’s no date or venue.

        This is just the first shot across the bows and the start of the posturing before my guess is that they agree on a 65/35 split to fight in somewhere like Wembley Stadium, with a rematch somewhere in America.

      • Jeremy, UK

        The fight won’t make $100m, maybe not more than $50m. Do you see the problem with your logic? Also take into account the overheads and the THOUSANDS of people who need to be paid for putting on an event like this. Factor in that the gate receipts and TV money doesn’t all go directly to the fighters. One final thing to consider… this is SIX HUNDRED PER CENT more than Wilder has ever earned before ( Joshua’s pay rise percentage will be much lower guaranteed) and also puts Wilder in line to earn this kind of money every fight if he wins. Joshua is at this level (financially), Wilder isn’t. If this fight doesn’t happen, the blame lays firmly at the feet of Wilder and his team.

    • Arjay Cee

      You’ll never be a top promoter if you keep giving away your secrets on the Internet!

  • Teddy Reynoso

    The offer should have been without the caveats as people will tend to see it as made tongue in cheek or with way out clause for Joshua.
    Hearn should have merely added a not so subtle missive: “Top that”.
    Or make a better counter offer.

  • Teddy Reynoso

    Both Hearn and Finkel are sorely missing the whole point that what is on stake here is the heavyweight championship of the world not of the UK or USA and their “areas of influence” or parts of the globe that recognize either AJ or Wilder is true champ. As it is despite everything that has happened since Fury defeated Wladimir Klitschko and Wilder ascended to the WBC throne vacated by Vitali K, the real heavyweight championship of the world remains vacant. Given that, any flag waving or boasting claims of either parties to be the A side on account of earning through crowd drawing and or PPV capabilities do not matter as much in the reckoning. Business is an integral part of boxing but boxing per se is not business. Ali and Liston fought their rematch before a relatively small live fans in Lewiston but everybody knew that it was for the heavyweight championship of the world. Ali fought Foreman and Frazier (who some claimed as undeserving of the opportunity) outside of the USA which was then as now the universal boxing capital and everybody acknowledged those as for the heavyweight championship of the world. What I am saying is that regardless of the venue, what is more important is that the AJ-Wilder fight should be universally viewed and recognized as for the heavyweight championship of the world. With that foremost in the minds of the protagonists and all concerned, I think a middle ground can be reached instead of the resort to this already sickening oneupmanship which will.accomplish nothing.

    • Guy Grundy

      I hear you Teddy and you talk common sense BUT common sense is often in short supply in big time professional boxing.If you’ve followed Hearn ( he has a whiff of the artful dodger about him) I think he’ll clearly control the negotiations,no matter what Wilder’s people will try to claim.At this moment Wilder needs the Joshua fight more than Joshua needs it…he can ( very) happily let it marinate for longer while he takes a mandatory.He’s already getting far far more money than Wilder,pulls in 80-90,000 for his fights compared to Wilder’s shockingly miserable drawing power,is already a powerful cross brand even out side the UK and so on and so on.Wilder has very little,save that final belt.

      • Teddy Reynoso

        Again what profits AJ when half of the world does not know or acknowledge him. That’s the main point of my common sensical earlier post.

        • Julio

          I’ll do you one better, nobody on planet Earth knows who Wilder is aside from the 20 fans he has including his family and friends in Alabama.

          • Al mac

            Julio you are just an AJ fanboy that is constantly spamming the boards with your drivel. I bet you are getting a semi thinking about AJ you disgusting little man

          • Julio

            Aw little mac is upset. Poor guy! What’s the matter? You couldn’t beat Tyson in Punch Out, is that it? LOL. Anyway. Nope, I am actually not a fan of either guy. I just tell it like it is. If it was Wilder filling out arenas and making 20M per fight I would say the exact same thing about Joshua. Time for you to grow up.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            That’s myopic and parochial, Julio. UK and the US do not constitute the boxing world. There s a bigger world outside that’s used to be a major consideration in putting up major heavyweight fights, most of all for the heavyweight championship of the world. Why denigrate or exaggerate the drawing or earning capacities of Wilder or AJ just basing on their performance in your local markets? The wide outside world has been waiting for this fight to happen and I would say willing to pay to see that fight as we used to during the halcyon days of Muhammad Ali down to the era of Tyson, Holyfield and Lewis fighting for the honor and prestige as undisputed heavyweight champion of the world.

          • Julio

            Teddy, I couldn’t agree more with your salient points. But again, you are still living in the past. The boxing climate is much more different today than in the old days. There is no intent to denigrate or exaggerate. I was just a tad picturesque while describing both scenarios. Lighten up Teddy.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            If Wilder is more known outside of the US, then you have a big problem there. But to quote the bible, a prophet is never recognized in his own home land. Surely, we know Wilder out here. AJ not much because traditionally, we get our big fights from US networks.

          • Julio

            Only the hardcore heads, which are only a handful Teddy. Why not accept reality? Joshua is the bigger draw, end of story.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            Who cares?

  • Teddy Reynoso

    The UK may be in its most golden age of boxing but Hearn and AJ should realize that the bottom line is not always measured in pounds or Euros or dollars and how many local butts are on seats. Like it not, but because the US is eons ahead especially in major heavyweight boxing promotions as far as the global audience is concerned, Finkel and Wilder cannot be relegated to the beggars cannot be choosers category. The biggest, most successful heavyweight champions that Europe has produced or adopted as Lennox Lewis and the Klitschkos needed to.fight most of their important bouts in the USA to achieve crossover superstar status. How many outside of the UK showed interest in and or actually viewed the recent AJ-Parker unification fight? How many outside of the US with respect to the Wilder-Ortiz bout? I could say that more Pinoys followed and tuned in to the latter.

    • Julio

      Teddy, the Klitschko’s fought primarily in Europe, particularly in Germany. They raked in several millions without the need of the US resources. Wladimir fought only 12 times out of a total 69 bouts in the US. He did just fine like that in his career. Besides, Wilder has been horridly promoted by Di Bella and that has aided in limiting Deontay’s ability to make reasonable demands. Take what is offered, make your statement by dethroning the money maker.

      • Teddy Reynoso

        Why should it always boil down to economics and boundaries? If it is really for the heavyweight championship of the world, income sharing and venue should not be much of an issue. The global audience will take care of that
        Wladdy may just have 12 bouts in the US but those helped greatly in making him known to the rest of the world as Calzhages pitiful few US bouts.

        • ozzy

          AJ-Parker was shown all over the world because boxing is becoming more popular all over the world & AJ is one of the boxers making the most of this. The Klitschkos showed that relying on a US audience to make your millions isn’t essential if you have a good audience at home. I’ve no doubt that AJ will make his US debut eventually, but it will be because he wants to, not because he has to, he can make millions without giving up home advantage. BTW Calzaghe couldn’t fill Wembley stadium like Joshua can, again and again, so you’re comparing apples and pears there mate.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            Do you have any figure of how the AJ fights fared outside of UK and Europe? The only fight that got our interest and attention here in our region was versus Klitschko and that’s because Wladdy is known around here on account of his fights in the US not Europe or Germany.

        • Julio

          Because that is the reality of the boxing landscape in this day and age Teddy. Plain and simple. The way things should be is totally irrelevant. Don’t make it sound like Wilder is getting lowballed here. He would be making several times more whatever he has made in any single fight. And since this shouldn’t be about economic boundaries, how about winning the undisputed heavyweight championship? That should be Wilder’s major objective instead of worrying about how many ducats he can collect. Regarding Calzaghe, I don’t hear him complaining about his “pitiful” US bouts.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            You are obviously from there and does not know how we view things from our end here, outside of the West. You also sounded like you don’t have a grasp of heavyweight history in saying that what used to be is totally relevant given the heavy business orientation of the sport today. But for an awful long time, until recently, the heavyweights was the pariah of international pro boxing and it’s top names fighters including the Klitsckos were fighting for mere pittance compared to what the Mayweathers and Pacquiao’s were getting just to get the acclaim as the heavyweight champion of the world. You make it sound that the heavyweight championship has suddenly become the priciest holy grail because AJ possesses 3/4 of the titles and that he has been earning millions fighting in his corner of the world? That’s not how the heavyweight greats attained their greatness. Money was never this important. We don’t care about your economics and flag waving competitions. What we care about is how best the fight could be promoted and projected here as the fight that would determine the true heavyweight champion of the world.

          • Julio

            Again, Teddy, let go of the past. We live in a different era. And let me tell you, I grew up watching the late, great Salvador Sanchez, Leonard, Hearns, etc. Great times for boxing, but again, boxing is different now.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            What’s wrong with pining for how boxing was in the past which was so decidedly better than how it is today and for some time now because of a prima donna self acclaimed tbe and his legacy which poorer versions are trying hard to emulate. Surely boxing was not like this as late as in the 80s even the 90s when the Leonards and the Tysons held sway. They were crowd drawers and great income generating machines but they didn’t flaunt it and fans didn’t talk about it. And that fact did not prevent fights against their biggest rivals from happening. There was no mention of who was the A side only of their willingness to test themselves and to take on all willing and able challengers. Unlike today when fighters are more concerned with their records and how much they ought to earn and fans like you are talking of who deserve to earn more ( what do we care for or stand to benefit from that?) instead of talking of the fighters merits.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            The trouble with you people is that you are just putting up posts to disagree or argue without presenting or representing any advocacy to help raise boxing from the abyss it has fallen into in the name of business and crass commercialism. At least I am for bringing boxing to the way it was in its golden ages of the old and recent past.

          • Andy T

            Teddy times have changed it is not only the purse Joshua gets it is all the endorsements you never see him without ear sets in or a sponsored drink on the table etc, time moves on not always for the better but when we look back we cherry pick the good bits and there has always been fights what never got made for one reason or the other.
            Lennox v Bowe

          • Teddy Reynoso

            Boxing indeed is different now and for some time and It’s gotten worse.

          • Julio

            Worse indeed. Its like our parents telling us all the time while growing up that going to college and working for a corporation for 30 years is/was the only way to strive in life. In this era, that is no longer the case.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            Non sequitur. You have obviously run out of better argument. Who in his right mind would not want boxing to be like it used to be so simple, so good and so great as before when we get to see great fights without much ado and at less or no expense on our part as fans and viewers? Bashing your minds talking about how much a fight could generate and what fighter ought to get more only serve to whip up the flames of commercialism that’s burning down boxing especially in the US and the West. No fight no pay used to be true only to boxers. Now fans are also faced with that no pay, no fight (to view on TV where it used to be free).

          • Julio

            Teddy, I couldn’t agree more with your salient points, but alas, we live in a different time and the previous post was made to further illustrate how things have changed. The world has changed and you have to move along with it if you want to remain functional. Look at you, visiting these boards frequently maybe as much as your typical Sunday conversation with friends.

          • Andy T

            Not in the UK , Eddie Hearn and Frank Warren are putting on great shows and boxing is booming so I am flag waving

        • Guy Grundy

          You’re usually one of the more erudite posters on here but on this matter I’m afraid you’re either being incredibly naive about the current state of world boxing ( and its economics) or you’re simply unaware of the massive progress made elsewhere in the world. As stated and discussed in a recent article in the Ring, the preeminence of America ( and indeed Vegas) in world boxing is long gone..and nowhere in recent years has that been better illustrated than in the heavyweight division.The reality is that non-US boxers don’t require the US market as they once did to make serious money nor gain recognition.

          America just another market…nice to have but not essential.

          • Teddy Reynoso

            I might be currently naive of the current state of heavyweight boxing and its so called economics now but that has nothing to do with pining for what used to be where the superstars and big top names willingly fought each other and money matter and billing were not big issues or stumbling block for the right to be called the world heavyweight champion. Mind you, the money involved back then was comparatively huge also but it did not take precedence over the prestige of the championship.

            I may not also be aware of the massive development made elsewhere in the world (which is understandable as we have yet to feel or get wind of it in our part of the world. For most If not all Asian fighters raring to make it big, the surest way is still get the exposure in the US, I repeat US ring, not Europe, particularly UK).

      • Son Lyme

        Exactly this. Take the career high pay day, knock the glass jawed Joshua out in one, and become the undisputed champion. You can ask for whatever you want then.

  • ozzy

    DiBella clearly doesn’t know that Wilder is unknown to the citizens of New York and so I think Joshua does NOT need Mr Wilder as much as Deontay needs Joshua. However, that said, Deontay deserves a bigger share than Parker who got about 33.4% according to the UK press and so 40% for Wilder seems a reasonable enough figure.

    Wilder fans, apart from making ridiculous claims about how much Joshua will make for the fight, also think that this shows that Hearn and Joshua are frightened to take on Wilder. I don’t think Joshua is frightened of anyone but I do think that Hearn wants to show to Wilder that those helping him, DiBella & Finkel, aren’t very good and that he can make him more money than they can, just so long as Deontay signs with him. All this argy-bargy between Team Wilder & Team Joshua is because Eddie Hearn wants to promote Wilder as well as Joshua. Unfortunately for Wilder, I think Hearn can, and is prepared, to do many things to force Wilder into doing exactly that. One of those things is refusing to give him more money for this fight unless he signs with him and if he won’t he’ll make sure the Joshua-Wilder fight won’t happen anytime soon. The only person who can help Wilder is Anthony Joshua himself, who is desperate to become undisputed champion, he may not allow Hearn to hold out as long as he’d like to in order to get Wilder’s signiture. Let’s hope all this comes to nothing and that the fight is made very soon – I’m not gunna hold me breath though.

    • Guy Grundy

      You’re right about Hearn wanting to promote Wilder…and frankly why wouldn’t he when you see the abysmal,pathetic job his present promoter and team has done for him to date.He earns a ( relative ) pittance,considering he’s 40 fights in,his shows attract very modest crowds,he has few marketable qualities and absolutely no cross brand awareness whatsoever….he’s Mr Invisible in his own country.

      • kingpin914

        Wilder has 2 of the top 5 viewed fight on premium cable (showtime/HBO) in the last 5 years, the most being his fight with Ortiz who’s average viewership was north of $1 million. He’s not as unknown as you all seem to think.

        Furthermore, Wilder started boxing late in life and thus has limited amateur experience. As a result he was brought on slowly through the pro ranks to supplement that.

    • Crowley

      Well how about the lions share of the purse goes to the actual winner?

  • calvin

    i remember when Floyd offered $40 million flat to Pacquiao. everybody cried bloody hell.

    Canelo then offered GGG $10 million with PPV upside if the sales hit a certain mark. everybody cried bloody hell.

    now Wilder is offered $12.5 million flat and everybody tells him to just shut up and take it?

    in a fight this big a flat fee is an insult. boxing fans have been in agreement of that forever. until now.

    the only way i say Wilder should accept this flat fee is if he puts it in the contract that he won’t participate in any interviews, commercials, countdowns or conferences. Wilder should be a complete ghost until fight night. let AJ carry the whole promotion. let him do the tour by himself. if your purse is set then why should you give a damn how successful the event is.

    look at how upset Hearn got when Wilder didn’t show up in Cardiff. he understands the importance of promotion. would he accept these terms from wilder? doubt it.

    • Al mac

      Also Wilder should not agree to any rematch clause so AJ doesn’t have a guaranteed shot at the title.

    • Teddy Reynoso

      Agree

    • Andy T

      Did GGG and Pacquiao agree?

  • Jerry Johnson

    So this Is the comments section that hates on American Blacks even when they right huh

  • Al mac

    AJ is clearly ducking the fight. Rather than come right out and say they don’t want the fight they send a joke offer that they know will be rejected. Joshua should remove his African Warrior tattoo as he’s a gutless coward who has no intention of facing Wilder in the ring. As Ernest Hemmingway said A coward dies a thousand times before his death but the valiant taste of death but once. Anthony Joshua may become rich fighting scrubs but it will eat away at his soul knowing that he ducked his greatest foe.

    • David T

      A joke offer…what is Wilder’s career high pay to-date?

      Exactly.

    • Jeremy, UK

      What a stupid comment. Joshua has achieved more in 21 fights than Wilder has in 40. I wouldn’t lower myself to call Wilder a coward – he isn’t… but he (and his “managers”) have not yet shown the bravery and willingness to take risks that AJ and his team have.

      • Alan

        Oh? Has Joshua beaten Ortiz? No, he was “fighting” Parker instead, lol.

        • Jeremy, UK

          Going into their respective title fights last month, Parker was rated higher by The Ring ratings than Ortiz. He is younger, fitter and faster than Ortiz. He has fought and beaten better opponents than Ortiz. What was the point you were trying to make Alan?

    • Andy T

      The only fighter to duck a unification fight is Wilder, after he fought Bermane Stiverne the first time he could have had all the belts in one go, as he can now, but as a World Champion with 33 fights under his belt, Joshua has 21 fights he wasn,t ready .
      His team have come back with 0 offers to Eddie so is now going to renegotiate in New York with them Why if Joshua does not want the fight?

  • Left Hook2

    Wilder should reject it. I mean, he made $3M I believe vs Ortiz. It will only take windmill 4 successful defenses over the next 2 years to make that money. With his technical brilliance he should have no problem outboxing anyone on his schedule. Or….he can take the $12M…enhance his status win or lose. If he wins, he makes quite a bit more in the rematch. If he loses…depending on how he loses, he could still stand to be better off in the long run. This is a no-brainer..but then again…this is also Wilder…

  • EternallyILL

    According to boxing scene, Eddie Hearns initial offer to Parker was reported to be a 30/70 split. If the Wilder/Joshua pot is 50 million, 12.5 million dollars equals a 23/77 split. Is Parker 7 percentage points better than Wilder?

    • Left Hook2

      Dollars….Parker was paid about $6M. That means Wilder is worth twice as much–$12M. Vs Fury, Parker made $1.5M, so he got 4x to fight Joshua. Wilder made perhaps $3M vs Ortiz…so he will get 4x to fight Joshua.

      • EternallyILL

        Your numbers are misleading. The purse for Parker might have been 6 million but Parker has yet to collect on PPV, Merch, ect. Which he will receive 33% to Joshua’s 67% (The ring mag has articles verifying the split). The Wilder-Joshua fight will gross more than Joshua-Parker. Wilder’s last fight did 1.3 million views in the states, Parker doesn’t do that anywhere. Why should Wilder take 12 instead of the percentage they were willing to give Parker?

        • Left Hook2

          He doesn’t have to. He can fight for $2M against Brazeale. And $2M more against Whyte. He is being gifted an opportunity to make 4x his purse AND the opportunity to be undisputed. If he wants anything else, he can give up his belt, fight an eliminator for the #1 spot for one of the other orgs, and then go to a purse bid. No matter how you slice it, $12M is much greater than $2 or 3M

          • EternallyILL

            just cause it’s more, doesn’t mean its fair.

          • Jeremy, UK

            Just because Parker got (potentially) a bigger slice of a smaller pot, what does that have to do with Wilder? If he can earn half of what he is being offered elsewhere (which he can’t) then go for it. But it won’t be for the undisputed championship of the world and it won’t reallly give him the opportunity to earn this kind of money in the future. Joshua’s next fight is huge… Wilder’s only huge fight is vs Joshua.

          • EternallyILL

            If your better at something, you get paid more than someone who is not as good. That’s a simple principle that works in all walks of life, except apparently in the UK. Also, It will be a career high payday for both, not just Wilder, Who will AJ fight that will generate that kind of income? (no one). They both need each other. Joshua’s next fight is huge……in the UK. in America AJ does like 400,000 views to Wilder’s 1.3M. and Isn’t it weird that Joshua sells 90,000 tickets to a fight and brings in 1/10th of what Mayweather’s Live gate was. Especially since Mayweather fought in arenas of 13-15K. Not comparing Wilder to Floyd just showing how AJ is smaller on a global scale than most people think.

          • Jeremy, UK

            I’m not sure I agree with your live gate figures entirely but, as you said, this isn’t Mayweather. I would also disagree with your comment, ” a simple principle that works in all walks of life, except apparently in the UK…” Was Cooney better than Holmes? Was Canelo better than Golovkin? Did those fights happen in the U.K. or the USA? Also humour me with this question.. pick any heavyweight and match them with Joshua and estimate the purse Joshua would get. Then match that same fighter with Wilder and estimate the purse he would get. If the figure you are estimating for Wilder is more than 20% of what your Joshua estimate is, then you are not being honest with yourself. What conclusion do you draw from that?

          • Son Lyme

            You’re simply wrong brother. Joshua willl face his mandatory Povetkin and will fill 90,000 seats in London and sell over 1 million ppv in the UK alone – nevermind the rest of the world. Meanwhile, in a municipal sports centre somewhere in Alabama 8000 will watch Wilder will face Breazeale for global ppv of under 200,000 because no one cares. This is the simple reality – and that is why business is business.

          • Left Hook2

            Joshua is worth far more than Wilder. He can make 4-5x what Wilder can fighting the same opponents. And have 80K fans pack a stadium. And he will continue to do so. I can understand both sides, but $12M–a huge pay increase for Wilder–and a chance to increase earnings exponentially? Yeah, that is the wise choice. It may work out that the fight gets made and he gets more. It is also just as likely that he loses in the next 2 years fighting for $3M a fight, never making that amount. My pragamatism tells me that the bird in hand is worth two in the bush.

  • bamladen

    How many people here thought Pacquiao should have took 40m to fight Floyd??? Being as he walked away with 100m, we see that would have been a dumb thing to do. How many people here thought ggg should have took the flat rate to fight Canelo??? Again, we see that’s a dumb thing to do. So why is it that everyone here wants wilder to take 12m flat for a 100m fight??? He doesn’t deserve half. But let’s not let your bias views insult the man and his profession.

    • Danny Mifflin

      he would of won back then.. then it could of been him as the money man cash cow fighter and took 200m a fight.

  • Tramond Nicholson

    Wilder, nor any other boxer in Wilder’s position, should accept a flat fee for what might be the biggest heavyweight title fight of the last 15 years. No competent management team would advise Wilder to take a low offer based on the condition that he could make more in a potential rematch that may or may not come to fruition.

    • Danny Mifflin

      Wilders fights are shit, why should he get overpaid. AJ v Wilder is NOT the biggest fight in 15 years.. unless you are 15 years old.

      • Andy T

        Not even the biggest in the UK Fury is Back!

  • Mike Prado

    “…(Joshua) could walk down Fifth Avenue and no one would know who he is. He needs Deontay Wilder as much as Deontay needs him.’’

    Um, I have a sneaky feeling Wilder would sooner be noticed mulling around Piccadilly Circus than walking down Fifth Avenue.

  • BobbyPFalcon

    This was an offer designed to avoid Wilder. Two heavies should be sharing ppv proceeds, etc. Also, Wilder was not almost KO’ed by Ortiz. He was never seriously hurt and the very next round proved it.

    • Danny Mifflin

      12 million is retirement money for ANYONE

      • BobbyPFalcon

        True, but it’s a dodge offer for these boxers and promoters. Hearn is just saying he wants no part of Wilder, hence the lowball offer no promoter would ever consider.

        • Son Lyme

          Lowball? Are you thick? It is more than Wilder has earned in the last THREE years put together.

  • Crowley

    He offered them 25% in hopes they’ll say no and Wilder won’t slaughter his cash cow. Pathetic.

    70-30 where the winner takes 70. Fair and square.

  • jebib

    I will admit I don’t clearly understand the dimensions of PPV money in prize fights. But I believe it puts it in another dimension otherwise why are all fighters attempting to become PPV fighters? The first question is if the $12.5million is a flat amount with no PPV money? My guess is if it is turned down it won’t be by Wilder but the people around him who won’t get the taste they want. If Wilder fights with the discipline that Parker did, and with a much longer hard left jab, I think he beats Joshua. His fight with Ortiz was somewhat misleading because it was a left/right matchup. Now that I’ve said it, it’s bound to be wrong!

    • Son Lyme

      His fight with Ortiz came four years too late.

  • ozzy

    An interesting interview of Eddie Hearn on IFL – imo he makes some convincing points about the Wilder offer. By the way it’s a long interview (just over an hr) and he says a lot about Wilder near the start but also near the end (about the 57 min mark) where he says that he expects Wilder’s next fight to be Breazeale NOT Joshua and revealed that AJ had fought the Breazeale fight with glandular fever – I was at that fight and thought something wasn’t right with AJ. Anyway here’s the link…
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8OZeTxJQ7k&feature=youtu.be

  • John Grady

    Unfortunately for DW and his team, they do not have much leverage in these negotiations. AW has generated far more money, can use this reality to justify demands for his getting the lion’s share of any purse, and can keep fighting other, more manageable contenders for great paydays. AW is also early in his prime years and has plenty of time, whereas DW is already at the end of his physical prime years.

    The only factor that might add a sense of urgency for AW to take the fight is the promise of the biggest purse of his career and his completing a legacy fight (since this would be an enormous event).

    Something tells me that DW will accept a less and go overseas to fight AW. I respect this very much, and wish AW would compete outside his comfort zone at some point (doubtful he would even consider doing so vs. DW).

    • Danny Mifflin

      ‘AJ’ you mean..

      • John Grady

        Yes, thank you… I’m not sure why I kept putting that down.

  • John Grady

    He has enormous power, a flawless record, quality personality, an incredible build – yet DW does not compel much interest from the boxing or sports world… I understand why he is not as popular as a Tyson or Holyfield, but I’m surprised that he does not command more attention.

    • Andy T

      I am at a loss why?

  • Crowley

    Call the bluff and knock his ass out for free.

  • Alan

    If a fight happens in England, does it really happen?

    I’d like to kick Hearn’s ass.

  • Alan

    Ask those England fans who were at the Parker fight who they would rather see in a fight, Wilder or Joshua, lol.

    Wilder should go to England fight on the same day as Joshua in a different venue and see who gets the bigger crowd–I’m guessing it would be Wilder at this point.

    • Danny Mifflin

      No one knows who Wilder is in the UK you uneducated fool.. Wilder sells 2000 tickets in the US, Josh gets 90,000. So if no one knows who he is in his own country how on earth is anyone in the UK going to? Alan you are so stupid you must be 13 years old.

  • badhombrebigdo

    It’s an insulting figure, but hardly peanuts. Wilder should take it, go and beat Joshua (which is well within his capabilities) and then come back to the bargaining table for a second fight with a stronger hand to play… He could easily then ask for double or even triple this figure…

    • Son Lyme

      What’s insulting about being offered five times more than anything you have previously earned?

      • badhombrebigdo

        Because the fight will do outrageously high numbers.. they’re not splitting the wealth up equally… and that’s just bargaining 101… never let the managers and promoters steal the broad lot of a big score… the regular fights and title bouts, sure, they’ll keep their beaks wetter than anyone else’s. But the super fights? Nah, the star’s HAVE to get paid… That’s how Iron Mike let Don King rob him…

  • JA

    Holyfield took short money to fight Tyson, saying he would make it up in the rematch after he won. Wilder can either make much more money now and (if he wins) dictate more later, or continue making his normal purse.

  • Patrick Hartigan

    A flat number like that is a low-ball offer for a fight like this. An event of that magnitude will generate a huge gate and a ton of British PPV revenue. Joshua is no doubt a huge draw in Europe but Wilder is the biggest opponent out there and holds the one strap that did not belong to Wlad, thus making this a much more intriguing unification bout than was the one vs. Parker. Not to mention Wilder just knocked out the most dangerous and avoided opponent available to him, leaving no doubt that he is a legitimate threat to Joshua. This should be agreeable as a 60%-40% purse split in favor of Joshua. There is no reason for Hearn not to ink it that way apart from him stalling to prompt more of a buzz and thus the “marination” of the event. It is a shame if this fight doesn’t happen in late 2018.

    • Son Lyme

      That flat number is five times the best payday Wilder has ever earned. And if he doesn’t want it – fair enough – he can stick to fighting in community halls in Alabama facing the likes of Breazeale. If it gets made mandatory guess who will win the purse bid.

      • Patrick Hartigan

        It is. But if you remember all the posturing that led up to Maywether-Pacquiao you will remember Floyd pulling the same stunt and offering Pac-Man a flat 40 million or so. Though that would have been the biggest payday of Pacquiao’s career he turned it down and eventually made 9 figures with a purse split deal. The A side will almost always make that move in these and similar situations. Nevertheless, much like was the case with Pacquiao (as a Mayweather challenger)—nobody will regard Joshua as the best if he does not go through Wilder. This fight has to happen and Al Haymon is not a dummy, he won’t leave 7-8 million dollars on the table. Wilder will eventually get a better deal. And PLEASE don’t call Wilder a “community hall” fighter. He is a legitimate World Champion who just electrified the Barclay’s Center with a knockout of one of the most dangerous, feared, and avoided heavyweights in the world. That was a much bigger feat than was lifting an alphabet strap in boring fashion from paper champion Parker…

  • Please Delete Me Let Me Go

    Wilder is fighting Breazeale next for $2m. If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck…