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Dougie’s MASSIVE Monday Mailbag

31
Jan

GREAT WEEKEND, HORRIBLE DECISION

Hey Doug,
Well, although the Gabriel Campillo-Beibut Shumenov decision left a very bad taste in my mouth, I thought this was a good weekend of boxing for the fans. I hope that the thing most people remember from this weekend is that you don't need a Pacquiao or a Mayweather to have good fights on television. Here are some of my questions/observations about this weekend's fights. Let me know what you think.

1. For the record, I scored the Campillo/Shumenov fight 117-111 for Campillo. Campillo is so economical, I bet he washes plastic silverware and reuses it. Most of the punches he threw seem to be right on target, even if there wasn't a lot of power behind them. He also did a good job of blocking or partially deflecting most of Shumenov's punches, which is why I had Campillo winning handily. Although the decision was horrible, I'm still glad this fight happened, since these two guys have now established themselves as respectable opponents for the top of the light heavyweight division. Campillo/Dawson and Shumenov/Cloud are fights that I REALLY want to see now. Who do you think wins those two fights?

2. Along with Campillo, Jesse Brinkley made himself a fan right here this weekend. I always enjoy watching a fighter simply show up and do what he has to do to win a fight, especially when his opponent has been talking all kinds of trash. As long as he can resist the urge to go straight back with his hands down, I think he can give anyone but the top super middleweights a hell of a fight. With most of the top super middleweights tied up with the Super Six, where would you like to see him go from here? A fight with Sakio Bika, possibly? Also, I loved the fact that Peter Manfredo Sr. ran into the ring at the end of the fifth round to protect his fighter, and that he was in Brinkley's corner even though his son was fighting in another city.



3. Chris Avalos looked like a world-beater, as usual, but I wish Nieves could have continued fighting the way he did in the first round. I wanted to see if Avalos could make adjustments during the middle of a fight if things were going exactly his way. How far do you think Avalos can go in the bantamweight and super bantamweight divisions?

4. Nice win for Jorge Arce, but I was more impressed with Angky Angkota and his ringpost impression during the fight. That guy definitely has a second career when he decides to hang up the gloves.

Well, that's all I've got. Hope this one isn't too long to make the mailbag, since I'd really like to hear your thoughts on this past weekend of boxing. Keep up the good work, Doug. — Brian Lee, Lincoln, IL

Good observations on a good weekend of boxing, Brian. I’ll respond to them in order:

1. I scored Friday’s light heavyweight title fight 116-112 for Campillo and I thought I was being generous to Shumenov. Duane Ford, who scored it 115-113 for Shumenov, had a bad night. Patricia Morse Jarman, who had it 117-11 for Shumenov, had the worst night of her judging career. She’s usually a very capable judge (when Fernando Vargas isn’t involved). Having said that, I think it was a damn good fight by light heavyweight standards. Those 175 pounders threw a lot of leather and showed some big balls. I agree that the exposure was a good thing for them and for the light heavyweight division, which is in need of new blood almost as bad as the sport’s current pool of main event judges. Basedon what I saw Friday night, I would favor Campillo to beat RING-ranked light heavyweight contenders Adrian Diaconu (No. 9), Yusaf Mack (No. 7) and Tavoris Cloud (No. 6). I think the Spaniard would give Dawson a very good fight, but I’d pick Bad Chad to win that one by close, unanimous decision. I think Cloud vs. Shumenov would be a fight of the year candidate — probably the best 175-pound slug fest since Julio Gonzalez battled the late Julian “Mr. KO” Letterlough — one, that the hardnosed Floridian would win by close decision (unless, of course, the fight takes place in Vegas and Ford and Jarman are judging).

2. Brinkley’s a real vet and underrated IMO. The dude has all-around skills, ring generalship and a nice counter-right hand. I worked the broadcasts of his two fights last year and I was impressed with how relaxed he is in the ring. I think Manfredo Sr. is getting more out of Jesse than he did training his son, and I think Brinkley can beat some top 168 pounders (including beltholder Robert Stieglitz). He and Bika would be a good toss-up fight, but I think Brinkley wants a shot at a belt next and he’s got one with Lucian Bute thanks to his victory on Friday. Unfortunately, I think Bute’s style is all wrong for Brinkley.

3. I think Avalos is the goods as long as he isn’t rushed to the top of the competitive 118-pound division. He’s not ready for badasses like Abner Mares yet, but I think he could get some good experience fighting some of Abner’s victims such as Diosdado Gaby and Damian Marchiano, two vets that would give Avalos what he needs: quality rounds.

4. That’s a funny line about Angkota. Hey, he did what he was supposed to do with the popular veteran, make Arce look like he’s got another year of fighting in his legs. I still hope Arce retires soon. I don’t want to see him get beat up and embarrassed by Nonito Donaire or any other young gun. I enjoyed watching Eduardo Escobedo fight in the co-feature of that Top Rank Live card. That’s a seasoned youngster I’d like to see in with a featherweight contender next time he’s on TV.

DANGEROUS FIGHTS

What up Doug,
I'll keep it short. Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather “egoed” their way out of fighting each other now both of them are about to get there asses whooped. Joshua Clottey is no joke and I've always thought that Sugar Shane was better than both of them. Floyd isn't big, strong and long like Winky Wright and the late Vernon Forrest. I think Mayweather truly didn't want this fight but the situation made it impossible to do anything else. Talk about intrigue, what's Money the chump going to do when he can't get a guy just as fast and skilled as he is off of him? The difference between Floyd and Shane is the Sugarman wants to knock your ass out. Damn, I can't wait. By the way, my gut feeling says Andre Dirrell takes out Arthur Abraham and Andre Ward stops Allan Green (another cat with more mouth than game). Talk to you. — Big 313

I like Ward and Abraham by decision in those Super Six bouts. I’m looking forward to covering both from ringside, but I’m really excited about Mosley-Mayweather. Mosley is always motivated but he’s really something special when he takes on a fighter that he’s wanted in the ring for a long time. Mayweather has dismissed and disrespected Mosley for the last four years. Now it’s time for him to back his mouth up in the ring.

I agree that Clottey is no joke. I think the Ghanaian is more difficult and dangerous than Cotto was for Pacquiao because of his style and specific strengths. We’ll see what happens. Maybe the big welterweight showdown of late 2010 will be Mosley-Clottey.

MOSLEY, MAYWEATHER & MARGARITO

Hey Doug,
Just wanted to say a few words about the Mosley vs Mayweather fight. I would like to see Mosley beat Mayweather up really bad but I don’t think it will happen, in his last fight against Margarito he looked so freaking good only because Margarito was mentally broken down, Margarito's body was there getting the s__t kick out of it but I think in his mind all he could think about is how he got caught cheating. So basically I think it’s gonna be a pretty easy fight for Mayweather. I really hope I’m wrong. How do you see this fight?

I also think that Margarito should be banned for life from boxing. There’s no freaking way he didn’t know he had that in his wraps. I box and when my trainer wraps my hands I can see everything he’s doing. Well, keep up the good work man, and can’t wait for the Edwin Valero vs. Antonio Demarco fight on Saturday. It should be a good one. — Josue

I can’t wait for Saturday, either. It will be good. DeMarco is a solid, young contender and “my son” always delivers excitement.

You can’t keep Margarito from getting his license reinstated but you, as a fan, can ban him for life by boycotting all of his future fights.

For the record, I think it’s possible for a fighter to not pay attention to his hands being wrapped and we have to keep in mind that Capetillo was busted by Brother Naazim as soon as one of the “plaster” inserts was put into the wraps. So it’s not like Margarito had a lot of time with it in there. He never had the wrap completed with a glove on. He never hit anything with the insert.

I don’t think his mind was gone when he entered the ring with Mosley. I’m more familiar with Margarito than most fans and boxing writers. He doesn’t let anything bug him before a fight. I just think he had a bad night (he always did whenever he had a bad camp) with a badass. Mosley was motivated and he whupped that ass like no other fighter ever has. No excuses. Give Shane the credit he deserves for that victory.

Or just wait until he gives Mayweather a beating.

FLOYD'S GAMBIT

Doug,
Can't contain my excitement regarding the Mayweather-Mosley match-up. I was skeptical when I heard the rumblings that Golden Boy was working on trying to make this fight, as I simply didn't think Floyd would ever fight Shane, but now that it’s done this has gone along way, at least for me, in erasing the Pacquiao-Maywether fall out.

The way I see it everybody wins in this scenario, well everybody but Top Rank and Team Pacquiao whose own 'plan b' now pales in comparison. Golden Boy wins because they now have the biggest fight of 2010. Mosley wins because he finally gets to cash in on his great victory over Margarito last year and ensures he'll have at least one more Superfight before the end of his career. Mayweather also wins, but not because he FINALLY stepped up to the plate and accepted a seriously tough fight, because lets be honest IT’S WHAT HE IS SUPPOSED TO DO! But to me he's coming out of this thing looking like an evil genius. I think the argument that he was 'scared' to fight Manny has now lost a lot of its steam, especially in the light that he's facing a guy who pretty much did everything short of offering to fight Manny with one arm behind his back and Team Pacquiao seemed to want no part of it. Also if Floyd wins and wins impressively, its going to be hard to argue against him being elevated to the top of the pound for pound rankings, regardless of how good Manny looks against Joshua Clottey.

Clottey is nice (by the way I'm shocked at how many people think Manny will stop him), but fighting the guy who lost to the guy whose ass you just royally kicked is a step back as far as I'm concerned.

Finally, we the fans are the big winners, we get the consensus #2 vs. #3 (P4P) fighters in the world and it also marks the first time, in my mind at least, since Mayweather took on Diego Corrales way back when, that an opponent of Floyd's has a legitimate shot of defeating him.

This is a great fight for boxing fans, maybe not the event that Pacquiao-Maywether would have been, but for the diehard fan its more than a reasonable facsimile.

(P.S – I'm picking Mayweather to win by a decision, but I don't envy you Doug. Floyd's 'nut hugger nation' is going to be out in full force for this one… you need to release like a 'deleted scenes' version of your mailbags, lol.) — Tom G.

Floyd’s fans have been very quiet since the Pacquiao fight fell out. I wonder what’s up with them. Something tells me the thought of their boy fighting this hardnosed “old” vet makes them nervous. We’ll see what happens.

I favor the 38-year-old Mosley by close decision or late stoppage. Mosley has trouble with boxers, and Mayweather certainly qualifies as a top-notch boxer, but it’s the tall rangy types that dominate him. Boxers his height (or smaller) can give him trouble in the first half of a bout but they are usually in for a hard time down the stretch (see Shane’s fights with James Leija, Luis Collazo and Miguel Cotto for examples of this). Of course, if Cotto can out-point Mosley, Mayweather, who is faster, sharper and rangier than the Puerto Rican, certainly can. However, I have to point out that Mosley fought the 30-0, pre-Margarito version of Cotto and gave him fits in the late going.

Anyway, I agree with you. Everybody wins with this matchup. I’m keeping my fingers crossed that Mayweather signs by the time this mailbag is posted, and that once the fight is finalized that both boxers stay healthy until fight time.

MAYWEATHER VS. THE GREATS

Ray Robinson & Leonard were the only debatable fighters on the list. Mayweather would clown Armstrong, Gavilan (especially Gavilan), and Burley. I'll be honest, I don't know much about Charley Burley but, I know enough about him to know he couldn't touch Lil' Floyd.

Floyd will beat Mosley and Pacman before he is finished. And after seeing Paul Williams' performances against Carlos Quintana (1st time) and Sergio Martinez, I think you would have to be a fool to think Lil' Floyd couldn't outbox him for 12 rounds.

Floyd gets a lot of negative press for his recent competition but, I remember. I remember when he was fighting Zab Judah everybody wanted him to fight Carlos Baldomir. And he did. When he was fighting Baldomir, everybody was saying how he was ducking Ricky Hatton. Than he knocked out Hatton. Than everyone said he couldn't beat Oscar. So, he did. Technically speaking, Floyd HAS fought and beat EVERYONE the boxing public has requested. It isn't his fault that he is so good that he exposed them fighters as not being in his class. Some people REALLY thought Baldomir and Hatton had a chance. Now, the G.O.A.T. is debatable in any sport. But, I will say this, Floyd Mayweather Jr. is the most TALENTED fighter of all time. — Tommy

You have a warped take on recent history, Tommy. There was no huge public demand for Mayweather to fight Baldomir or Hatton. Prior to the De La Hoya fight, Floyd was only known by hardcore fans and the diehards wanted him to fight badass welterweights like Margarito and Cotto. No one gave a rat’s ass about Baldomir (who was just a Zab Judah creation) and PPV numbers to this fight support my claim. If you can find more than five credible boxing writers who thought Baldomir had a chance in hell to beat Mayweather I’ll mail you a $100 bill.

Post-De La Hoya nobody cared to see Mayweather defend the welterweight title against Hatton, a guy who went life and death with Luis Collazo at welterweight and who looked ordinary in out-pointing Juan Urango at 140 pounds. I’ll say this about the Hatton fight, at least the Brit’s popularity and HBO’s 24/7 series made for an event that helped to further Mayweather’s crossover celebrity that began with the De La Hoya fight.

However, Mayweather “retired” rather than face the media’s and the public’s demand to fight the winner of Cotto-Margarito. And he fought the 36-year-old lightweight champ when he decided to come back.

It’s funny. Before he fought De La Hoya, Mayweather claimed that Goldie only fought smaller and older fighters on his way up. Now look what Mayweather does while on top of the proverbial mountain. At least the next “old man” Mayweather faces is a real welterweight.

You might be right about Mayweather’s chances vs. Mosley, Pacquiao and P-Will, but we’ll never know until he fights them. One fight at a time, kid. Let’s see what happens on May 1.

Your thoughts on Mayweather vs. the Greats are absolutely ridiculous and unfounded. Thank you for being honest about not knowing much about Burley. Now be honest about Armstrong and Gavilan and admit that you’ve never seen a complete fight of either all-time great. And if you have, you don’t know what you’re looking at.

EMPIRICAL DATA ON FLOYD & ROBINSON

Dougie,
When I read that Floyd vs. The Greats article, I ralphed. I know Floyd passes the “eyeball test” with flying colors (he just looks dominant), but so do the Harlem Globe Trotters. I don’t think they’d fair too well against the 1987 Lakers.

I decided to do some homework. Below is cold, hard data. These are Floyd's last 12 fights dating back to his last legitimate opponent who was naturally in his weight class (my notes in parenthesis). The names in bold are his fights at welterweight against welterweights.

2009:

-UD Juan Manuel Marquez (2-division jump UP for JMM, Floyd doesn’t make weight)

2008: INACTIVE

2007:

-KO 10 Ricky Hatton (Jr. Welterweight champ fighting at welterweight, only other welterweight fight he went life and death with Luiz Collazo)

-SD Oscar De La Hoya (Moved up for big $, solid win, nothing spectacular)

2006:

-UD Carlos Baldomir (On 15 occasions, Carlos got in the ring and did not win)

-UD Zab Judah (Record as welterweight: 7-5-1)

2005:

-KO 6 Sharmba Mitchell (Record as welterweight: 2-3)

-KO 6 Arturo Gatti (We love Gatti, but come on)

-KO 8 Henry Bruseles (Previous fight was a Draw against Ener Julio)

2004:

-UD Demarcus Corley (Lost his previous fight)

2003:

-TKO 7 Philip N’Dou (N’Dou’s best opponent to that point was Cassius Baloyi)

-UD Victoiano Sosa (2 fights prior Sosa drew with someone named Lamar Murphy)

2002:

-UD Jose Luis Castillo (Won a narrow decision against an excellent fighter)

Hard facts:

1. Floyd has not fought a legitimate champion in their weight class since 2002, when the Rams were in the Super Bowl.
2. Floyd is 3-0 (1) welterweight vs. welterweights, with his best win being against Carlos Baldomir.
3. His true welterweight opponents have a combined record of 52-17-7 vs. welterweights.

Now, I’m only 30, so I didn’t get to watch Ray Robinson fight live, but I've watched a dozen or so of his fights on ESPN Classic. Here is what Sugar Ray Robinson did as a welterweight vs. welterweights:

1. 30-0 (20)
2. Wins over Kid Gavilan (twice) and Henry Armstrong
3. As a welterweight, went 4-1 against Jake Lamotta, who was fighting at middleweight.

Guys please, and I mean please, stop mentioning Floyd Mayweather in the same category as Ray Robinson. It would be like comparing Scott Mitchell to Peyton Manning. Or, even worse, like comparing Floyd Mayweather to F’ING SUGAR RAY ROBINSON!!!

Please stop.

Go Harlem Globetrotters!!! — Danny

Well stated and researched, Danny.

Now why can’t Mayweather fans do this kind of homework?

Oh, right, because that would shatter the illusion.

I get it.

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