There were so many emails on Pacquiao-Hatton, my column on Pacquiao vs. the five all-time greats, Mayweather-Marquez, and other PacMan-related subjects from the weekend and the early part of this week, I HAD to do an extra mailbag. I'll have more of your emails, including some on Dawson-Tarver II, in Friday's bag. Enjoy!

MAYWEATHER VS. MARQUEZ

Hey Dude,
Nice coverage on Manny Pacquiao vs. Ricky Hatton. I enjoyed your Keys to Victory as well as the Preview Show with that other nice dude, Leigh Simons. I look forward to seeing more of that in the near future.

What's there to say that hasn't already been said about Paquiao's impressive victory over Hatton … So I’ll turn my attention to Floyd Mayweather vs. (the small) Juan Manuel Marquez:

Finally, Marquez gets paid.

Floyd’s got speed, size, and defense advantage on Marquez. But Marquez has heart, determination, will, and has faced better current opposition, while Mayweather will come in rusty.

I would say they are just about even in skill, ring intelligence, and power.

At best Mayweather will run to a boring decision, or get a controversial decision. But I hope Marquez wins. I’m just amazed at how many experts are seeing this fight as an easy win for Mayweather. Dude! That is so not the case, I give you props for being one of the few to give Marquez a decent shot.

Oh, and if Pacquiao vs. Mayweather happens then I think Pacquiao is the favorite and Mayweather would be the underdog. Mayweather doesn’t have the power to get Manny's respect and keep him off for 12 rds. That’s just my opinion.

(P.S., If Paul Williams cant get another fight, why not go up one more division and face Carl Froch? That’s one fight I’d pay to see.)

Take care Dougie. — Jorge, San Diego

Williams is willing to step up to super middleweight, but he and his handlers are calling out Bernard Hopkins, who happens to be calling out Froch.

Call me crazy — I’ve been called a lot worse (especially from nutty PacFans lately) — but I see Mayweather-Marquez as an even fight. Both vets have styles that will trouble the other.

MEDIA EXCUSES

I've been reading plenty of articles from you and a lot of the answers you have given in response to many boxing fans mail, but one answer you gave really bothers me. Why are you making more excuses about Manny's opponents because of the obliteration they received? One which I will really discredit you is, 'why put Manny down?' It's like there's no end to Manny satisfying any analyst. When he beats Oscar into submission, they said he was weight drained. It's not Manny's fault Oscar was drained, it was Oscar's fault and his team's fault. Give credit where it's due. And again, when Pacquiao defeated, what many analyst called Ricky Hatton, a prime fighter at the top of his game, you discredit Pacquiao again, saying Hatton was and I quote “a weight-drained Brit.” that Ortiz, Valero, etc could beat him too.

Cmon, everyone knew Pacquiao was going to win, but they said it'd be tough, but when the fight started and ended so quickly, it left all you analysts looking for excuses of how that happened so quickly. Now, Hatton's too washed up from trying to make weight. What happened to all the hype every analysts made? 'Oh Hatton's never lost at 140 lbs, don't under estimate his speed, he looks better training with Floyd Mayweather Snr. You guys are all great analysts, but you guys are all not giving credit for the true greatness of Manny Pacquiao. It's not bad defense, bad training, bad conditioning, or bad night. It was perfected Manny. — Suchi

You're being too sensitive. Please mellow out and get a grip on your emotions. I imagine that you have a high shrill whine of a voice when I read this email and it makes me cringe.

I also believe Pacquiao's a great fighter. I thought that BEFORE the De La Hoya and Hatton fights. I thought he was pound-for-pound No. 1 long BEFORE Mayweather retired. So please, kiss off if you think I have some kind of agenda against Pacquiao. The truth is, I recognized his greatness long before a lot of you hyper-sensitive Pac-Fanatics did.

THE PAC-MANIACS

At this point in time, would you say that Manny Pacquiao's fanbase bears a striking resemblance to Felix Trinidad's circa 2000-01?

I feel like they're getting carried away with the all-time great thing, and as I write this, I suspect that somebody on an internet message board is earnestly writing up a thread about how Pacquiao could have beaten Sugar Ray Robinson, Marvin Hagler and Roberto Duran, in succession. — gopal rao

You nailed it. Pacquiao’s diehard fans are just as delusional and caught up with their hero as Trinidad fans were of the Puerto Rican badass following Tito’s consecutive big-fight victories over David Reid, Fernando Vargas and Williams Joppy. Nobody knows this more than me. I started the Mailbag column because I was spending too much time answering an endless flow of emails from Trinidad fans who earnestly wanted to know how their idol would have fared vs. Sugar Ray Robinson (and got pissed off when I told them the truth). I figured if I was going to take the time to answer them all (and I tried my best to do so) I should get credit for my insight (and patience) in the form of an extended, free-form “Letters to the Editor”-style column. The rest is history. And history, as we know, has a way of repeating itself — especially in boxing.

So I’m happy to let the Pac-Maniacs go crazy over their idol. Let them have their day. You and I know it doesn’t last forever.

DOUG AND FLEETWOOD: VOICES OF REASON

Dougie,
Okay, I got caught up in the “Manny Mania” for a brief moment but I have finally come to my senses. Fleetwood stated it best “impressed but not completely sold.” Maybe we (since we're all from the “Show Me”) just have better boxing acumen. Listen, I like Manny (how could you not) but I just believe a little too much credit is being given considering who his last three opponents have been. Two made to order and one weight-drained (make that two) fighters. Roach looks like a genius but I believe otherwise. Trust me, once the Pacman gets popped with a couple of hard rights or combos, he'll revert to his old self.

I've tried to argue this point with the Manny Nation (I was outnumbered at the party) and they just don't get it. In fact, most have no clue about boxing or his record prior to '06. I think his fans are already as bad as Money’s and RJ's were back in the day. This whole thing on “one of the greatest” makes my stomach turn. It's almost if no one remembers Sanchez or the first JMM and Morales fights. Okay, he's come a long way but it says here that Mosley (145-147), and JMM beats him. Oh wait, JMM beat him already, at least IMHO. Geez, had to get that off my chest and type it before I hear the wifey ask if I'm still looking at ^&%$#@ boxing on the internet. — Sean in Hellay, MO

I don’t know if Pacquiao would “revert” to his “old ways” if he got caught a few times, but I suspect that he won’t look as devastating when he fights a smart fighter with good legs and reflexes. The winner of Mayweather-Marquez will provide the current pound-for-pound king with such a foe. I’m probably going to piss off Manny Nation (I like that) even more than I already have with this statement, but I think someone like Kendall Holt would give Pacquiao fits and even threaten to beat him.

I’ll probably get 20 emails from insecure PacFans just for that last paragraph, but so what? It comes with the job. You, on the other hand, shouldn’t waste your time with Manny Nation. You are absolutely right about most of them being ignorant about boxing and even their own hero prior to 2006. I’ve covered most Pacquiao’s major fights in the U.S. beginning with his first fight in America (the IBF 122-pound title win over Lehlo Ledwaba) — including his training camps — and I vividly remember the days when he had NO fans, and when many Filipinos and Filipino-Americans were skeptical of his potential. I was ringside for this title fights against Agapito Sanchez and Emmanuel Lucero. His current jock-riders weren’t. You watched those fights on TV. They didn’t. So just keep that in mind and save your breath (or cut down time in front of your laptop) if the New Generation PacFan wants to argue with you.

PAC @ WELTERWEIGHT

Hey Dougie,
I wanted to congratulate you on your writing both at Maxboxing.com and now at Ringtv.com. I just finished watching the fight. Wow! Pacquiao is really something!

Do you think Hatton quit or was he knocked out cold? For some reason, I feel like Ricky didn't want anymore punishment and remained down. Which, you know, it's nothing to be embarrassed about. Also, how do you see Manny fare up to Cotto and Mayweather at welterweight? Will he clean up the division? Best Regards. — ├üngel

Hatton was out so cold I thought he might be dead for a few chilling seconds. Homeboy definitely didn’t quit. What happened to him was the definition of KTFO.

Honestly, I think Pacquiao can do well at welterweight against both Cotto and Mayweather as long has he doesn’t weigh-in too heavy.

ALL TIME GREATS

Those top 5 fighters you mentioned were all time greats in there weight classes. When Pacman was in those weight classes he was not in his prime. You have to consider that, when talking about other fighters in other classes and comparing Pacman with them. He has morphed into a much more well-rounded fighter. Pryor is the only one you can really compare to Manny, since he is closer to his prime in the 140 lb class. I still don't think we have seen the best Manny. And by the way, you said depending on his fight with Hatton, you will be revisiting your 5 all time greats. He demolished Hatton and did way better than you expected. So why are you so pissed at the people e-mailing you? — Jose M.

Didn’t you read my story? I absolutely considered that Pacquiao wasn’t fully developed as a fighter at 122 and 126 pounds. That’s part of the reason he lost those mythical matchups. People who don’t know a left hook from a fish hook know that Pacquiao “has morphed into a much more well-rounded fighter”. You’re not telling me anything I didn’t already know.

And by the way, you are misreading the tone of my email responses in the Mailbag. I’m not pissed at all. I get a little bit annoyed with belligerent Pac-Maniacs, but who wouldn’t? Read the next email and then imagine getting 80 of those a day since Sunday. That’s what I have to deal with every time I go into my inbox.

LIVING IN A FANTASY WORLD

I think youre a stupid, Hard-to-pleased, racist bigot…. PACMAN is a different animal.. maybe just because he is asian you think He is a lesser fighter than your Stupid Fantasy fighters.. The PACMAN doesnt fight for you PRESS people, He fights for us true Boxing Fans! — Christopher

You are not representing Pacquiao or his fans very well, Chris.

THE MYTHCIAL FIVE

Doug,
Hi, this is my first time to write at your column and i just wanna say i appreciated and enjoyed all your writings and replies at the Mailbags and Weekend Reviews, thanks man..But i like to comment about your Five so could “Mythicals”, i dong think thats fair. One, you cannot compare fighters unless you actually see them at the actual fight.Look, we all disagree that Pacman can beat the Goldenboy?Right? Floyd “The Joke” Mouthweather Sr. even noted that he don't need him (to train the Goldeboy) to beat the Pacman but as we all see the rest was history. Second, we cannot rate fightighters of differrent eras. I'm not the genius of boxing history but I think the boxers of this time are equipt of what they learn from the Greats of Boxing. Boxers, as i like them to see as what my Professors in Science would say, are “EVOLVING”. They learn from the best, from History.Third, Manny “PACMAN” Pacquiao is beyond comparison, i hope you will also agree if i say that all the Greats of Boxing is beyond comparison, right. I respect your knowledge in boxing history and I'm a great fan and follower of you and Ring Mag for a long time but i should say i definitely DISAGREE with your column regarding the Mythical Five. thanks, till next time. — Pauez of Tondo, Philippines

No offense, Pauez, but who died and made you Manny Pacquiao?

By the way, many real boxing historians — most notably Mike Silver (author of the Arc of Boxing)– will tell you that, on average, skill and technique among professional fighters has been on the decline for decades. Apart from a few exceptions, I tend to agree with Mr. Silver.

ATGS, HOW CAN WE TELL?

Hey Doug,
Like many I was interested to see your article on how Pacquiao would fare against those all time greats. I pretty much agreed. I think Pac has no chance with Sanchez, who is JMM but way better; a 50/50 with Gomez and less of a chance against Pryor.

But after the blowout on Saturday I was thinking; we've all seen footage of these ATG's you mentioned. But it seems the names that come up in the top 10 and 20 p4p lists are old timers. How can we rate Harry Greb when NOBODY has seen him fight? The same can be said of Benny Leonard, Barney Ross EVEN to an extent Henry Armstrong. My question is how can you form a detailed opinion simply from a few clips? I'd also like to know your own top 10 p4p list (of all time). Thanks! — Richy P., Yeovil, England

I agree that it’s hard to rate and compare the REALLY old timers (pre-1930s) like Harry Greb and Benny Leonard (or Joe Gans and George Dixon) with fighters of the 1950s on to the present. On top of the fact that there isn’t a lot of film footage to observe and study, the sport and boxers’ styles were different than what we see today. However, you have to give those turn-of-the 20th Century and 1920s-era fighters props for their activity and the caliber of opposition they were forced to fight. The records of the hall of famers from that era always reveal that they fought numerous fellow hall of famers, almost always more than once. I’ve been lucky to know boxing enthusiasts who are old enough that their parents saw the likes of Greb, Leonard and Gene Tunney fight live. I take their word for it when they tell me those fighters were great. If you have any doubts about the merits of Greb and his peers, I suggest you read everything you can about them. That’s how I first learned about them.

It’s interesting to note that the sport has changed even during my lifetime (I was born in 1970). An X-factor to all five mythical matchups is what rules the fighters fought under, 1970s/80s or today’s rules. I assumed that readers would assume that the fights were 12 rounders in which the combatants weighed in the day before the fight. However, if we went by the ’70s/’80s rules, fighters would weigh-in the day of the fight and the bouts would scheduled for 15 rounds. I think those rules would favor my mythical five.

SPEAK THE TRUTH!

“This ain’t Carlos Baldomir, a faded Oscar De La Hoya, or a made-to-order Ricky Hatton, this is Juan-Mother-F__king-Marquez he’s stepping in the ring with, the man who gave Manny Pacquiao pure hell last March and then knocked out Joel Casamayor and Juan Diaz.”

Amen brother! I’m not Mosley-Margarito sure but I will be taking Marquez as what I think will be an underdog line that is severely bloated. All you idiots that think Floyd is going to walk through this keep writing inÔǪ.just gets me better odds! This will be a terrific tactical fight. As long as JMM doesn’t take any on the chin (everyone says Floyd has more power than meets the eye), he’s in this fight.

My one concern: EVERYONE wants Floyd- Pac. So, if this fight is close, which I think it will be, they’re going to rob JMM. — Tony, LA

They better not. The difference between Marquez’s fight with Mayweather and the close decisions that did not go his way in the past (vs. Freddie Norwood, Pacquiao and Chris John) is that on July 18 he’ll actually have a significant diehard fan base in the seats cheering for him.

MARQUEZ HAS NO SHOT!

Dougie,
I give Marquez NO SHOT at beating Floyd, he is too small. I know weight doesn't win fights. If they were both naturally the same size I would give him a shot. He is not going to outbox Floyd and he doesn't have the power to steamroll him. They are both technical boxers and Floyd is bigger and more defensive.

I noticed you mentioned twice in the mailbag that Hatton was weight drained, I never read that. Do you have some evidence, and come on, we used that excuse for DLH, lets not pi$$ on Manny's parade, he earned it, nobody thought he would do that and there were no excuses before the fight. — JB

Hey, I give Pacquiao 100% credit for wiping his little butt with Hatton’s fat head, but all you had to do was look at pics of the Brit at the weigh-in to know that he was totally dried out. His cheeks we’re sucked in and you could see his entire ribcage. Here’s some insider info for ya: Hatton had eight to 10 12-ounce bottles of electrolyte-replacement drinks set up just behind the weigh-in stage that he downed in succession immediately after weighing in. You don’t have to be a doctor to know that ain’t a good sign.

Both Kirk and Darryl talked me out of assuming a Mayweather victory on July 18. Let’s see if you can reason me back to giving Marquez no shot. Tell me how Mayweather beats Marquez. Seriously. I’m curious to hear some detailed reasons from anyone beyond Mayweather’s size and undefeated record.